open carry and $$$ possible.

[indianajones]

I wasnt sure where to put this. open carry? scenereo's? or legal. I picked here.

Lets say you do get arrested for open carrying. They take your gun, haul you to the station and book you.

What are the costs envolved? court fees? things like that. (obviously if it goes that far)

What if it doesnt? what if you are arrested and then let go say 4 hrs later when they discover they messed up? do you have any recourse? or do you just walk out with nothing???

[Venator12]

I wasnt sure where to put this. open carry? scenereo's? or legal. I picked here.

Lets say you do get arrested for open carrying. They take your gun, haul you to the station and book you.

What are the costs envolved? court fees? things like that. (obviously if it goes that far)

What if it doesnt? what if you are arrested and then let go say 4 hrs later when they discover they messed up? do you have any recourse? or do you just walk out with nothing???

See these links, where this happened to a person. http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/forum30/15415.html http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/users/14087.html

The person is Chris Fetters (Screen name on opencarry.org is p8ntgames). PM him and asked what it cost. He is also looking in to legal recourse in this case.

Often an attorney wants a $500 retainer fee to start (fee varies). Often the case will be dropped before the $500 is used up (a couple letters, a few phone calls, etc.) As for a suit after, who knows, if you win often you can recover legal fees, some lawyers work on a contingency, that is, a portion of the settlement. Some attorneys won't charge you until they win, others want their fee regardless of the outcome.

So my guess, based on personal experience (not in an OC case) is anywhere from $500 to $10,000 depending on the complexities of the case and how far you want to go with it.

[dontfeelbad]

This kinda bothers me. I want to start OCing, and I accept that someday down the line a LEO will bring it up. If I were to get arrested, and found not guilty what is the likelihood of being able to have my lawyer counter-sue for court and legal costs?

EDIT: Whoa whoa whoa... MCL 750.234d (http://www.michigan.gov/documents/msp/MSP_Legal_Update_No._66_238184_7.pdf) In the list of places I can't OC a pistol, schools are not there, Did I miss something?

[cwo4uscgret]

This kinda bothers me. I want to start OCing, and I accept that someday down the line a LEO will bring it up. If I were to get arrested, and found not guilty what is the likelihood of being able to have my lawyer counter-sue for court and legal costs?

EDIT: Whoa whoa whoa... MCL 750.234d (http://www.michigan.gov/documents/msp/MSP_Legal_Update_No._66_238184_7.pdf) In the list of places I can't OC a pistol, schools are not there, Did I miss something?

I do believe that schools fall under other areas of the law but definitely are (as well as drug free) also weapons free.

I think that you should contact the Marysville PD, Port Huron PD, and St Clair County Sheriff's Office and ask them what their policy is with regards to the Open Carry Law. As we spoke about in private messages just because you may legally carry a firearm in the open you will still fall under very close scrutiny of local law enforcement officials. Try to contact LT Case at the Port Huron PD during the daytime and ask him about Open Carry.

Good luck. Even though the law says you can carry openly (in accordance with .234d) you will still create a still and as we talked - probably meet the local PD up close and personal. How you conduct yourself will greatly enhance your chances of it being a positive encounter. Visible hands (notice I said hands) at all times are very important. Passing a LEO's attitude check (hello, how are you) is also key.

I remember back in the mid-80s I was at the San Gabriel Valley Gun Club in Duarte, CA. My MGB broke down and I had no way to get home with 2 rifles and a 1911 Commander with ammo in an ammo can. The rifles were in soft side cases. I walked all the way through the town (4 miles) to the terminus of the 605 Freeway to wait for my wife to get me. No one stopped or challenged me...when I saw my wife coming (we had a Red SAAB Sedan) and thought I was saved - I heard a car door being closed quietly...and heard keep your hands where I can see them.... It was the LA County Sheriff's Office; 5 cruisers of them. The wife said "is he under arrest (bitch)" and the kids were really perplexed. Once they checked my story out it was OK but was very tense for a few minutes. The .45 was unloaded and that helped immensely. Of course when this happened it was at the height of the LA Freeway Random Shooting that terrorized LA in the 80s.

[langenc]

There is a fellow carrier in VA that went all the way and was awarded $10000. Not long after he was detained again. A couple of the LEOs the second time were also involved in the first fiasco. He is being encouraged to see what the pay off is for second offense!! (one or 2 more zeros)

See VCDL site. May have something posted.

[Venator12]

I do believe that schools fall under other areas of the law but definitely are (as well as drug free) also weapons free.

I think that you should contact the Marysville PD, Port Huron PD, and St Clair County Sheriff's Office and ask them what their policy is with regards to the Open Carry Law. As we spoke about in private messages just because you may legally carry a firearm in the open you will still fall under very close scrutiny of local law enforcement officials. Try to contact LT Case at the Port Huron PD during the daytime and ask him about Open Carry.

Good luck. Even though the law says you can carry openly (in accordance with .234d) you will still create a still and as we talked - probably meet the local PD up close and personal. How you conduct yourself will greatly enhance your chances of it being a positive encounter. Visible hands (notice I said hands) at all times are very important. Passing a LEO's attitude check (hello, how are you) is also key.

I remember back in the mid-80s I was at the San Gabriel Valley Gun Club in Duarte, CA. My MGB broke down and I had no way to get home with 2 rifles and a 1911 Commander with ammo in an ammo can. The rifles were in soft side cases. I walked all the way through the town (4 miles) to the terminus of the 605 Freeway to wait for my wife to get me. No one stopped or challenged me...when I saw my wife coming (we had a Red SAAB Sedan) and thought I was saved - I heard a car door being closed quietly...and heard keep your hands where I can see them.... It was the LA County Sheriff's Office; 5 cruisers of them. The wife said "is he under arrest (bitch)" and the kids were really perplexed. Once they checked my story out it was OK but was very tense for a few minutes. The .45 was unloaded and that helped immensely. Of course when this happened it was at the height of the LA Freeway Random Shooting that terrorized LA in the 80s.

So you as suggesting he ask permission to exercise a right recognized by the state?

My advice don't ask the police anything about open carry, we have found that 90% or more don't know it's legal, or they do know it's legal and tell people they will arrest them anyway. Or try and talk them out of it for various and dubious reasons. They also have been known to lie and point to a local ordinance they have that states OC is illegal and not tell them that their ordinance is illegal due to preemption.

This person really needs to go here and learn more about OC before he does anything. http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/forum30/

Not sure why the story about LA was brought up. Two very different states.

[who dat]

This kinda bothers me. I want to start OCing, and I accept that someday down the line a LEO will bring it up. If I were to get arrested, and found not guilty what is the likelihood of being able to have my lawyer counter-sue for court and legal costs?

EDIT: Whoa whoa whoa... MCL 750.234d (http://www.michigan.gov/documents/msp/MSP_Legal_Update_No._66_238184_7.pdf) In the list of places I can't OC a pistol, schools are not there, Did I miss something?
This group of CEZs do not apply to open carry for people with a CPL. Ergo, you may OC with a CPL.

This law applies to those with a CPL, ergo you may not carry at all: 2000 PA 381 5o (1)

Pistol Free Areas

Individuals licensed to carry a concealed pistol by Michigan or another state are prohibited from carrying a concealed pistol on the following premises:



1.
Schools or school property but may carry while in a vehicle on school property while dropping off or picking up if a parent or legal guardian

2.
Public or private day care center, public or private child caring agency, or public or private child placing agency.

3.
Sports arena or stadium

4.
A tavern where the primary source of income is the sale of alcoholic liquor by the glass consumed on the premises

5.
Any property or facility owned or operated by a church, synagogue, mosque, temple, or other place of worship, unless the presiding official allows concealed weapons

6.
An entertainment facility that the individual knows or should know has a seating capacity of 2,500 or more

7.
A hospital

8.
A dormitory or classroom of a community college, college, or university

9.
A Casino

"Premises" does not include the parking areas of the places listed above in 1 through 8.

A pistol is subject to immediate seizure if the CCW permit holder is carrying a pistol in a "pistol free" area. The following penalties may also be imposed:

* First offense: State Civil Infraction, $500 fine, CCW permit suspended 6 months
* Second offense: 90-day misdemeanor, $1000 fine, CCW permit revoked
* Third and subsequent offenses: 4-year felony, $5000 fine, CCW permit revoked

Furthermore, effective March 29, 2001, per Administrative Order 2001-1 of the Michigan Supreme Court:

*
"Weapons are not permitted in any courtroom, office, or other space used for official court business or by judicial employees unless the chief judge or other person designated by the chief judge has given prior approval consistent with the court's written policy."

[ghostrider]

This group of CEZs do not apply to open carry for people with a CPL. Ergo, you may OC with a CPL.

This law applies to those with a CPL, ergo you may not carry at all: 2000 PA 381 5o (1)

Pistol Free Areas

Individuals licensed to carry a concealed pistol by Michigan or another state are prohibited from carrying a concealed pistol on the following premises:



1.
Schools or school property but may carry while in a vehicle on school property while dropping off or picking up if a parent or legal guardian

2.
Public or private day care center, public or private child caring agency, or public or private child placing agency.

3.
Sports arena or stadium

4.
A tavern where the primary source of income is the sale of alcoholic liquor by the glass consumed on the premises

5.
Any property or facility owned or operated by a church, synagogue, mosque, temple, or other place of worship, unless the presiding official allows concealed weapons

6.
An entertainment facility that the individual knows or should know has a seating capacity of 2,500 or more

7.
A hospital

8.
A dormitory or classroom of a community college, college, or university

9.
A Casino

"Premises" does not include the parking areas of the places listed above in 1 through 8.

A pistol is subject to immediate seizure if the CCW permit holder is carrying a pistol in a "pistol free" area. The following penalties may also be imposed:

* First offense: State Civil Infraction, $500 fine, CCW permit suspended 6 months
* Second offense: 90-day misdemeanor, $1000 fine, CCW permit revoked
* Third and subsequent offenses: 4-year felony, $5000 fine, CCW permit revoked

Furthermore, effective March 29, 2001, per Administrative Order 2001-1 of the Michigan Supreme Court:

*
"Weapons are not permitted in any courtroom, office, or other space used for official court business or by judicial employees unless the chief judge or other person designated by the chief judge has given prior approval consistent with the court's written policy."+What I don't understand is, where do people get that it applies to any form of carry when it specifically prohibits "concealed" carry?

I realize it's an area that hasn't been tested (other that the MSP stating that CPL holders may OC in those areas), but I see no where that it restricts OC for a CPL holder in MCL 28.425o.

[dougwg]

This group of CEZs do not apply to open carry for people with a CPL. Ergo, you may OC with a CPL.

This law applies to those with a CPL, ergo you may not carry at all: 2000 PA 381 5o (1)

Pistol Free Areas

Individuals licensed to carry a concealed pistol by Michigan or another state are prohibited from carrying a concealed pistol on the following premises:

Ummm....

Maybe I can't read right or maybe I don't understand English but I don't see how you came to this conclusion.

[Garbo]

Whats your sudden interest in OC indy?? Am I going to see you tooling down 8 mile on your Harley OC'ing soon lol.

[fbuckner]

The schools arond here are drug and weapon free zones. I have a feeling you would be haulled off.

What i got to ask where and who will be passing the collection plate to fund some poor saps legal bills? Do I see a bunch of hands being raised as to who will be writing that retainer check.

[dougwg]

Whats your sudden interest in OC indy?? Am I going to see you tooling down 8 mile on your Harley OC'ing soon lol.

If he's carrying in the "open" on his motorcycle then according to the law he is actually Concealed Carrying".

[dougwg]

The schools arond here are drug and weapon free zones. I have a feeling you would be haulled off.

What i got to ask where and who will be passing the collection plate to fund some poor saps legal bills? Do I see a bunch of hands being raised as to who will be writing that retainer check.

What do you not understand about discussing the LAW as written?

NO ONE is telling ANYONE to go running around in a school with a gun.:roll:

[fbuckner]

What do you not understand about discussing the LAW as written?

NO ONE is telling ANYONE to go running around in a school with a gun.:roll:


Did I say run around a school witha gun ? Uhh Nah!!

What I said was Dougy is the schools here are posted Plain and simple..

What I did ask and yes it was a smart assed ... Whos taking up the collection to foot the retainer fee..

[Raspberrysurprise]

What my understanding is is that you can OC in a school zone IF you have a CPL.

MCL 750.234d (http://www.legislature.mi.gov/(S(xd4ufh3w0tp2wbyrz2flrf45))/mileg.aspx?page=getObject&objectName=mcl-750-234d)
Sec. 234d. (1) Except as provided in subsection (2), a person shall not possess a firearm on the premises of
any of the following:
(a) A depository financial institution or a subsidiary or affiliate of a depository financial institution.
(b) A church or other house of religious worship.
(c) A court.
(d) A theatre.
(e) A sports arena.
(f) A day care center.
(g) A hospital.
(h) An establishment licensed under the Michigan liquor control act, Act No. 8 of the Public Acts of the
Extra Session of 1933, being sections 436.1 to 436.58 of the Michigan Compiled Laws.
(2) This section does not apply to any of the following:
(a) A person who owns, or is employed by or contracted by, an entity described in subsection (1) if the
possession of that firearm is to provide security services for that entity.
(b) A peace officer.
(c) A person licensed by this state or another state to carry a concealed weapon.
(d) A person who possesses a firearm on the premises of an entity described in subsection (1) if that
possession is with the permission of the owner or an agent of the owner of that entity.
(3) A person who violates this section is guilty of a misdemeanor punishable by imprisonment for not more
than 90 days or a fine of not more than $100.00, or both.

So if you have a CPL you are exempt from these restrictions.

Now MCL 28.425o (http://www.legislature.mi.gov/(S(xd4ufh3w0tp2wbyrz2flrf45))/mileg.aspx?page=getobject&objectname=mcl-28-425o&query=on&highlight=750.237a) states

28.425o Premises on which carrying concealed weapon prohibited; “premises” defined; exceptions to subsection (1); violation.

Sec. 5o.

(1) Subject to subsection (4), an individual licensed under this act to carry a concealed pistol, or who is exempt from licensure under section 12a(f), shall not carry a concealed pistol on the premises of any of the following:

(a) A school or school property except that a parent or legal guardian of a student of the school is not precluded from carrying a concealed pistol while in a vehicle on school property, if he or she is dropping the student off at the school or picking up the child from the school. As used in this section, “school” and “school property” mean those terms as defined in section 237a of the Michigan penal code, 1931 PA 328, MCL 750.237a.

(b) A public or private child care center or day care center, public or private child caring institution, or public or private child placing agency.

(c) A sports arena or stadium.

(d) A bar or tavern licensed under the Michigan liquor control code of 1998, 1998 PA 58, MCL 436.1101 to 436.2303, where the primary source of income of the business is the sale of alcoholic liquor by the glass and consumed on the premises. This subdivision shall not apply to an owner or employee of the business. The Michigan liquor control commission shall develop and make available to holders of licenses under the Michigan liquor control code of 1998, 1998 PA 58, MCL 436.1101 to 436.2303, an appropriate sign stating that “This establishment prohibits patrons from carrying concealed weapons”. The owner or operator of an establishment licensed under the Michigan liquor control code of 1998, 1998 PA 58, MCL 436.1101 to 436.2303, may, but shall not be required to, post the sign developed under this subdivision. A record made available by an establishment licensed under the Michigan liquor control code of 1998, 1998 PA 58, MCL 436.1101 to 436.2303, necessary to enforce this subdivision is exempt from disclosure under the freedom of information act, 1976 PA 442, MCL 15.231 to 15.246.

(e) Any property or facility owned or operated by a church, synagogue, mosque, temple, or other place of worship, unless the presiding official or officials of the church, synagogue, mosque, temple, or other place of worship permit the carrying of concealed pistol on that property or facility.

(f) An entertainment facility with a seating capacity of 2,500 or more individuals that the individual knows or should know has a seating capacity of 2,500 or more individuals or that has a sign above each public entrance stating in letters not less than 1-inch high a seating capacity of 2,500 or more individuals.

(g) A hospital.

(h) A dormitory or classroom of a community college, college, or university.

(2) An individual licensed under this act to carry a concealed pistol, or who is exempt from licensure under section 12a(f), shall not carry a concealed pistol in violation of R 432.1212 or a successor rule of the Michigan administrative code promulgated pursuant to the Michigan gaming control and revenue act, the Initiated Law of 1996, MCL 432.201 to 432.226.

(3) As used in subsection (1), “premises” does not include parking areas of the places identified under subsection (1).

(4) Subsection (1) does not apply to any of the following:

(a) An individual licensed under this act who is a retired police officer or retired law enforcement officer. The concealed weapon licensing board may require a letter from the law enforcement agency stating that the retired police officer or law enforcement officer retired in good standing.

(b) An individual who is licensed under this act and who is employed or contracted by an entity described under subsection (1) to provide security services and is required by his or her employer or the terms of a contract to carry a concealed firearm on the premises of the employing or contracting entity.

(c) An individual who is licensed as a private investigator or private detective under the private detective license act, 1965 PA 285, MCL 338.821 to 338.851.

(d) Any of the following who is licensed under this act while on duty and in the course of his or her employment:

(i) A corrections officer of a county sheriff's department.

(ii) A motor carrier officer or capitol security officer of the department of state police.

(iii) A member of a sheriff's posse.

(iv) An auxiliary officer or reserve officer of a police or sheriff's department.

(v) A parole or probation officer of the department of corrections.

(5) An individual who violates this section is responsible for a state civil infraction or guilty of a crime as follows:

(a) Except as provided in subdivisions (b) and (c), the individual is responsible for a state civil infraction and may be fined not more than $500.00. The court shall order the individual's license to carry a concealed pistol suspended for 6 months.

(b) For a second violation, the individual is guilty of a misdemeanor punishable by a fine of not more than $1,000.00. The court shall order the individual's license to carry a concealed pistol revoked.

(c) For a third or subsequent violation, the individual is guilty of a felony punishable by imprisonment for not more than 4 years or a fine of not more than $5,000.00, or both. The court shall order the individual's license to carry a concealed pistol revoked.

Note how it says you cannot carry a concealed pistol, this is the key point.

Now does this mean you won't be arrested or otherwise harassed, no it does not, but it does leave you recourse in the courts should such occur.

All bolding is mine and I am not a lawyer.

[dougwg]

Did I say run around a school witha gun ? Uhh Nah!!

What I said was Dougy is the schools here are posted Plain and simple..

What I did ask and yes it was a smart assed ... Whos taking up the collection to foot the retainer fee..

They can post all the signs they want, they don't mean SHIT!

The only thing that matters is LAW!

[fbuckner]

Have at it I am charging the video camera battery as we speak.

They take the whole man with a gun thing kind of serious.

[dougwg]

Have at it I am charging the video camera battery as we speak.

They take the whole man with a gun thing kind of serious.


Certified NRA Instructor that can't differentiate between a sign and law.....wow.

And you teach others and they pay you for it?

Maybe a phone call needs to be made to the NRA about a certain someone encouraging people to go to a school with a gun.

Hows that for being a smart ass?

[Venator12]

The schools arond here are drug and weapon free zones. I have a feeling you would be haulled off.

What i got to ask where and who will be passing the collection plate to fund some poor saps legal bills? Do I see a bunch of hands being raised as to who will be writing that retainer check.
Can you post the law that prohibits OC in schools? I can't find any and I have been looking awhile. I would appreciate any laws you can cite. Thanks.

[fbuckner]

All I am saying is the school here s posted and they have a no weapons policy.
They have a no drug policy also which includes tobacco products and it doesnt matter if you are an adult sitting in the stands at a local football game. But I suppose you will encourage people to go light up a dog rocket and sit in the stands to.

Go ahead and call the NRA they generally dont pay attention to folks like you calling them. They will most likely call them and I will send them the thread and that will be that sport.

Like it or not you have basically told folks to OC where ever including school grounds. I am not against it Dougy boy not at all but encouraging people to stick it in their faces is more akin to what a kid who was picked on A LOT as a child would do. Shoving stuff down the throat usually causes a gag reflex and that is what you have done to a lot of people here. Thus the special thread

[fbuckner]

Maybe a phone call needs to be made to the NRA about a certain someone encouraging people to go to a school with a gun.

Hows that for being a smart ass?[/QUOTE]

Please show me where I said to do it sport? nah nowhere didnt think so.

Your the one saying and giving back alley legal advice that it isnt in the books. Heck I have carried open probably longer than you have I can put money on it. I know what the freaking laws are and I know there is a time and place for everything. For instance I dont carry at all while doing yard work. I have gotten pizza from Jets and pop from Kroger in the last week without a hitch. But do I walk around pushing my hip forward to show everyone Im the man? No I dont what I said about the schools here is it is posted and you went off about nothing.

[Venator12]

Maybe a phone call needs to be made to the NRA about a certain someone encouraging people to go to a school with a gun.

Hows that for being a smart ass?

Please show me where I said to do it sport? nah nowhere didnt think so.

Your the one saying and giving back alley legal advice that it isnt in the books. Heck I have carried open probably longer than you have I can put money on it. I know what the freaking laws are and I know there is a time and place for everything. For instance I dont carry at all while doing yard work. I have gotten pizza from Jets and pop from Kroger in the last week without a hitch. But do I walk around pushing my hip forward to show everyone Im the man? No I dont what I said about the schools here is it is posted and you went off about nothing.[/QUOTE]

Where is the law that states you can't OC at a school? I really need to know.

[Venator12]

All I am saying is the school here s posted and they have a no weapons policy.
They have a no drug policy also which includes tobacco products and it doesnt matter if you are an adult sitting in the stands at a local football game. But I suppose you will encourage people to go light up a dog rocket and sit in the stands to.

Go ahead and call the NRA they generally dont pay attention to folks like you calling them. They will most likely call them and I will send them the thread and that will be that sport.

Like it or not you have basically told folks to OC where ever including school grounds. I am not against it Dougy boy not at all but encouraging people to stick it in their faces is more akin to what a kid who was picked on A LOT as a child would do. Shoving stuff down the throat usually causes a gag reflex and that is what you have done to a lot of people here. Thus the special thread

Lots of cities have signs posted saying no firearms...they are illegal. A policy is not a law. Again please cut and paste the law that states you can't OC at a school. That is a public school, private schools can ban firearms.

And illicit drugs are illegal everywhere not just schools.

[dougwg]

All I am saying is the school here s posted and they have a no weapons policy.
They have a no drug policy also which includes tobacco products and it doesnt matter if you are an adult sitting in the stands at a local football game. But I suppose you will encourage people to go light up a dog rocket and sit in the stands to.

I encourage no one to do anything but learn the law.:book:

Go ahead and call the NRA they generally dont pay attention to folks like you calling them. They will most likely call them and I will send them the thread and that will be that sport.

I never said I wanted to call the NRA...sparky.:doh:

Like it or not you have basically told folks to OC where ever including school grounds.

I have not. That statement is a lie.:twak:

I am not against it Dougy boy not at all but encouraging people to stick it in their faces is more akin to what a kid who was picked on A LOT as a child would do.

I have encouraged nothing of the sort. If your grammar is any indication of your comprehension skills I can see why you made that mistake and I'll forgive you Frances.;)

Shoving stuff down the throat usually causes a gag reflex and that is what you have done to a lot of people here. Thus the special thread

I'm sorry if Facts and the Law make you or others gag. Perhaps if you don't like hearing the truth you should refrain from message boards as there can be lots of information that might be too much for you to handle.
BTW: It's not a thread, it's a sub-forum.

Please show me where I said to do it sport? nah nowhere didnt think so.

Here~~V
Have at it

Your the one saying and giving back alley legal advice that it isnt in the books.

I have not given ANY legal advice. I back up what I say with facts and the LAW. I didn't need to post it in this thread as others already have.
BTW: It's "you're" not "your":doh:

Heck I have carried open probably longer than you have I can put money on it.

Here's your gold star *

I know what the freaking laws are and I know there is a time and place for everything.

But you still think signs are laws too.:doh:

For instance I dont carry at all while doing yard work.

TMI, we don't want to know what you and the Mrs. do in the bed room.:shock:

I have gotten pizza from Jets and pop from Kroger in the last week without a hitch.

I have purchased beer from the corner store, purchased a bottled water and filled my gas tank up at the gas station and purchased coffee and creamer from Kroger. All of this I have done several times over the past 7 months without a hitch.....and your point is?

But do I walk around pushing my hip forward to show everyone Im the man?

Neither do I. That sounds kinda freaky if you ask me. Do you dream about this kind of thing at night?:shock:

No I dont what I said about the schools here is it is posted and you went off about nothing.

WE were talking about LAW and you butted in with some bull$hit about school signs and self admitted that you're first post was "smart assed".

Maybe we need another Forum. "fbuckner's off the wall, smart assed, off topic and bull$hit thread forum".

[fbuckner]

They can post all the signs they want, they don't mean SHIT!

The only thing that matters is LAW!


This right here is you saying it's ok .. It may be legal and I am fine with that but my point was and still is you will get hassled end of story.

Venator- I didnt say Illegal drugs. Tobacco is not allowed on school grounds per the no drug zone and school policy.

But if we can ignore the no weapons policy that we can also ignore the no tobacco policy and all light up the dog rockets at the football game while OC'ing.
For some reason chumly thinks I am arguing against OC again I am not tubby. I am all for it , I have done it and will continue to do so. What I dont like is this in your face attitude. There are better ways to get things done than spewing bravado and the Im smarter than you attitude. if this is your way of educating the masses Doug you wont get any farther than becoming a martyr but I have a feeling some are looking to be that person.

[Venator12]

This right here is you saying it's ok .. It may be legal and I am fine with that but my point was and still is you will get hassled end of story.

Venator- I didnt say Illegal drugs. Tobacco is not allowed on school grounds per the no drug zone and school policy.

But if we can ignore the no weapons policy that we can also ignore the no tobacco policy and all light up the dog rockets at the football game while OC'ing.
For some reason chumly thinks I am arguing against OC again I am not tubby. I am all for it , I have done it and will continue to do so. What I dont like is this in your face attitude. There are better ways to get things done than spewing bravado and the Im smarter than you attitude. if this is your way of educating the masses Doug you wont get any farther than becoming a martyr but I have a feeling some are looking to be that person.

If under 18 years old tobacco is illegal anywhere. As for those over 18 tobacco is prohibited on school grounds due to policy not law. An adult can have tobacco products on school grounds, they are not supposed to use them there. If they did they would break no law I'm aware of, but could be asked to leave as tobacco is not protected by preemption.

As for attitude I see it on both sides here.

[fbuckner]

I agree ther is attitude on my side and I apologize. But I hear a lot of lip service here. Like I have said before about OC I am all for it. Doing it in public parks is one thing or even at the store or walking down the street But this whole "what about school grounds?" And " I dont care what the sign says its the LAW" crap At this point I would like to se Doug put his money where his mouth is. I dont mean the fringe of school grounds I mean right down the hallway past the Principals office. This basic legal advice of saying it isnt illegal is moot unless you put an action behind it.

[indianajones]

Whats your sudden interest in OC indy?? Am I going to see you tooling down 8 mile on your Harley OC'ing soon lol.

You just might.

[indianajones]

If he's carrying in the "open" on his motorcycle then according to the law he is actually Concealed Carrying".

Not if I have a CPL. Then I can open carry under that.

[dougwg]

I made that post under the assumption that you have your CPL. My statement is correct whether you have a CPL or not.

[Venator12]

I made that post under the assumption that you have your CPL. My statement is correct whether you have a CPL or not.
Doug is correct. Technically when you carry loaded in or on a vehicle it is considered concealed and you need to have a CPL. Same in a car, if you are OCing in a car, it's still considered CC by the law.