SureFire's New Weapons Light: the X200

[Wesley w/Glock]

Visiting SureFire's web site I saw where they are introducing a new handgun weapons light having the model name X200. They are saying it will be available December, 2003. I was wondering if anybody knows anyting about it and where its application would be beneficial.

It is a LED system billed by SureFire as "the world's smallest high-performance LED weapon light." It is 4 times brighter than a two D-cell flashlight meaning that it can't compare in lumen output with the SureFire white lights that SureFire is famous for. This is probably its down side. They also claim "extended run time" which probably goes hand in hand with the diminished lumen output.

It appears that SureFire is claiming the reliability is enhanced relative to the typical SureFire because they say, "... there is no bulb to break or burn out, the X200 won't let you down when your life is on the line."

It mounts to the rails of Glocks and Sigs, and others just like the M3.

It is waterproof to 30 meters.

Searching the SureFire web site for the X200 produces zero results. I got my information from a pop-up when visiting the web site.

[goldwing2000]

I wonder how over-priced this one's gonna be.

[RSF]

For the average gun owner yeah they can be expensive! but then again i know a regular flashlight will work right! so will a car or motorcycle out off the lot, yet we dump a ton into them to make them better! I for one use and trust them day in and out and when lives can be on the line there is no excuse for not having the best gear! period! would you trust your life to a cheap knock off! i mean hey a hi point or jennings will do the job right

[goldwing2000]

I can see how a $100 flashlight may be useful for someone who depended on it but I just don't understand how two units with the same basic design can be so different in price. A flashlight isn't exactly a precision complicated piece of machinery, like a firearm or a vehicle.

Just my $.02, of course. Feel free to spend your money as you see fit!

Myself, I've never had a problem with a Mag-Lite.

[Wesley w/Glock]

Myself, I've never had a problem with a Mag-Lite.
You need to experience a SureFire!!!!!

I have the NRA model pitched in The American Rifleman magazine and it cost me about $75. It fits in the palm of my hand and is nearly concealed when I close my fist with my thumb over the end. Yet at 200 feet it lights up my barn with no annoying shaddowey thing in the middle of the beam.

The down side, though, is that you only get 60 minutes of use per battery load if you use the standard lamp. With the much brighter optional lamp use is only 20 minutes. But its purpose is not to help you navigate in the dark.

If I shine its light into the eyes of an attacker, he won't be able to see anything at all for a couple of minutes. If the "attacker" turns out to be a non-threat, the device has served another vital function--threat identification.

The SureFire lamps are awesome devices when used in applicable circumstances.

[Divegeek]

The new trend in lights for the last two years or more as been the LED variety and the HID.

LED = Light Emitting Diode
HID = High Intensity Discharge

You've all seen the HID's on the roads in high end cars. You can recognize them because their head lamps seem brighter and seem to have a bluish quality to them. They are very bright and low power, but are rather fragile. If they are dropped, the bulb is shot, and it costs a ton to replace them. Plus they take about 30-45 seconds to come up to full brightness. These two reasons make them bad for a Surefire style light. Great for Scuba divers and in use a head lamps though.

Now the LED's sacrifice a little in brightness, but they give back tons in the two departments I mentioned above. They are very tough, my dive light that uses them is subjected to tons of abuse that would destroy other lights and is still working great. They come to full brightness just as fast and a normal bulb does. And where they really shine (pun intented :wink: ) is the fact that they draw almost no current when on. My dive light is rated to 400 hours out of the standard AA batteries in it. And the bulb is rated for something like 10,000 hours.

So when you campare this to the standard Surefires, you are right it isn't as bright. You probably couldn't stun a goblin by shining it in their face. but the thing should last forever.

[goldwing2000]

The down side, though, is that you only get 60 minutes of use per battery load if you use the standard lamp. With the much brighter optional lamp use is only 20 minutes. But its purpose is not to help you navigate in the dark.

I guess I'd rather have one that I didn't have to change batteries in every day.

I prefer more utility in my tools.

I'm not saying that nobody should buy one, just that I'm not going to.

[RSF]

i change the battiries in my 2 cell surfires about once a month or so depending on how long i use them for! in my c3 with the high output bulb i havent changed them yet since it is a tactical light for use in defensive situations! you just cant carry a maglight with you all the time thats were these come into play. try carrying a mag light with you into the movie's at night or a bar or resturant and actually sure fires are a pretty complex piece of gear and do cost more to make there lends and lamps are indeed complex.

[goldwing2000]

You ever see an LED board, dep? They're NOT that complex.

Anyhoo...

I have a Mini-Mag that I use for a utility light, a Mini-Mini-Mag for pocket, a four-D for the car and a six-D for the house. And I can count on one hand how many times I've change batteries in all of them combined.

I'm happy. :biggrin:

[Kimber45]

I have a SureFire Z2 light with the P2 120 lumen lamp. You can find the Z2 for $47.00 less shipping online or for about $60 locally. For everyday use I have a 4 cell Maglight and a minimag. The right tool for the job. My SureFire goes with me everywhere my gun does.

Hey, dep you're going to have to show me your TID sometime.

[58Sniper]

The problem is that LED based flashlights have a very wide pattern. LEDs don't focus down real well, meaning you end up with a flood light and not a sharp, focused spot light.

Up close (vehicle stops), they are great. Longer distances (fields), they suck. And I'm not knocking SufeFire. I've got several thousand wrapped up in their stuff already. Just my observation.

[RSF]

no sweat john, i'am also putting one on my sig 226 weapons mounted light as well i have a 226 with a dedicated 632r light on a 226 with night sights that i use as a dedicated house handgun at night with a pre ban 20 rnd sig mag it is nice, i also keep a old streamlight ibelive 50 mx in my truck it is old and has a ton of miles i have a few mag lights around the house

[Wesley w/Glock]

You ever see an LED board, dep? They're NOT that complex.
All that I know about these things is what I have read at the SureFire web site although we have seen their use in the automotive industry increase the last couple of years. I have had to characterize several for computer simulation.

There is a characteristic of the human eye that lends the LED to energy savings which translates into longer battery life given a limited size. The human eye has persistence. It is this characteristic of the human eye that makes the CRT display technology used in computer monitors and TVs possible. If you were to expose the retina to a momentary light, the eye will think the light is still there for a period of time after the light is off. You can't utilize this effect to save energy with an incandescent bulb because of its relatively long startup and shutdown times. However, the light emitting characteristics of the LED are such that it will shut off and turn on in microseconds. You can therefore strobe the LED such that it only consumes battery energy for probably less than 5% of the time. To the human eye it "looks" like it is on continuously providing a constant stream of light. If you wait too long between energy pulses the eye will begin to perceive a flicker. In practice I think the maximum time between pulses needs to be something like under 30 milliseconds while the length of the energy pulse only needs to be maybe 50 micro seconds.

The SureFire web site has some fabulous technical descriptions of the various technologies they use. There is a huge amount of detail they give.

One thing that they mention in the paragraph that describes what the SureFire LED stuff is all about is that the LED flashlights are digitally regulated. I would venture a guess that this means that the energy delivered to the LEDs is pulse width modulated. This means electronics with feedback which design is technically demanding.

My big question is how effective would the LED beam be at dazzling a potential attacker? We know that the lumen output is less than the traditional SureFire white light. If the new X200 turns out to be just a fancy but reliable flashlight in a compact size for $100, then I lose interest.

I see the purpose of the SureFire as something we never use in almost the exact way that we HOPE that we never have to use our guns. The only difference is that in a pinch you can go ahead and use your SureFire to find your car keys or something like that. Just imagine using the muzzle flash of your gun to help you find your keys in the dark. :silly:

[Bob_T]

I can see how a $100 flashlight may be useful for someone who depended on it but I just don't understand how two units with the same basic design can be so different in price. A flashlight isn't exactly a precision complicated piece of machinery, like a firearm or a vehicle.

Just my $.02, of course. Feel free to spend your money as you see fit!

Myself, I've never had a problem with a Mag-Lite.

Have you ever used a Surefire light? My wife thought I was nuts when I bought my E2E. However, after she saw the light this little light gives off compared to a 2D cell Maglight, she "saw the light." Bright, super white, with no black hole in the middle of the beam.

I've had mine since August, use it almost everyday, and am still on the original set of batteries.

Comparing a smaller Maglight to a Surefire is like comparing a Wing to a moped. Both might get you to the store and have two wheels but after that a whole different beast.

Not saying you should spend your money on a Surefire, but at some point take a look at one because they are really incredible small lights.