Self defense v. murder - news story

[AimHigh]

http://www.sptimes.com/2003/11/01/Tampabay/At_what_point_is_it_n.shtml

Storer has no criminal record. The attacker had a long list of crimes. Had this been in TX, it would have not been a problem. But in FL or many other states, attorneys call it murder.

I have never been attacked, thank God, but I could imagine the anger of a man who has just been attacked at gunpoint. He must have been outraged and decided to "get him".

If I was a juror in this case, I would feel for this guy and give him a break.

What do YOU think?

[Jim Simmons]

A reduction to manslaughter seems appropriate, assuming the press got it right.

You don't ever EVER go after a bad guy after the crime is over with.

Not unless they have taken your spouse or child with them.

[Wesley w/Glock]

One can never just simply trust what the newspapers write up on anything but this looks pretty clear cut. The Florida restaurant owner actually left his place of business to pursue the gunman on the public streets. The Texas man never left his place of business. This is a CRITICAL distinction. This is dangerous for a variety of reasons but mostly because it endangers the general public. I really hate to say this but the victim became the attacker. He needs to be prosecuted for his crime. Let me also say, though, that the gunman also needs to be prosecuted but his crime was far worse (robbery with a gun) and the consequences should be comensurate.

I was sorry to see that the newspaper reporter was making this into something that it wasn't. In the article the writer says "The two cases raise questions about the sometimes blurry line between legitimate self-defense and Death Wish-style vigilantism." There is nothing blury in this story. I think the writer was just trying to make a story where there was none.

[goldwing2000]

"A few blocks later, Storer's truck slammed into the gunman... "

I guess I just fail to see how you can run over someone and call it self-defense. He wasn't trying to protect himself, he was out for revenge.

I do admire that auto shop owner, though! :badass:

[AimHigh]

Maybe he was following the criminal so the police could be alerted to where he is. Maybe the criminal pointed his gun at the guy and that's when the guy then ran him over. THen it's self defense. I know. Far stretch, but hey, you never know.

[Wesley w/Glock]

Once the restaurant owner left the premises for purposes of dealing with the robber in any fashion, a can of worms opened up. No longer is the case a slam-dunk self-defense case and at the very least he is looking at major attorney fees if any lethal force is even brandished in public.

Even in the case where the restaurant owner was just following, if a confrontation then results by even accident, the law will probably see him as escalating in a property matter. That is really, REALLY bad for him.

As CCW people we must abstain 100% when it comes to property crimes unless there are extenuating circumstances where life becomes involved.

[Scoop]

Did everybody miss/forget the story from earlier this year where a video store in Lansing was robbed and, after the robber left the store, the clerk (not even the owner) grabbed a baseball bat and went/found/chased down the robber?

Ultimately, he hit the robber in the head with the bat and the robber, Joseph Todd, later died.

The PA (Dunnings III) did NOT bring charges against the video store clerk, stating that it was self-defense.

The clerk went after the clerk AFTER the threat was gone, yet was acting in self-defense.

Things that make you go 'Hmmmmmmm'

[Wesley w/Glock]

There was another story in the news a month or two ago where a bank robber with a gun was chased and aprehended by a patron without a gun hundreds of feet from the bank. The patron wasn't specially trained in any way, he was just simply stupid from probably watching too much TV. The perp's gun was in fact real and loaded.

The important thing is that you want to keep things in a slam-dunk mode. It always has to be AOJ. Is there AOJ? If not, things get really super risky. The CCW person just might not even face prosecution after pursuing a felon for a property crime... but he just might.

[G22]

The patron wasn't specially trained in any way, he was just simply stupid

LOL You got that right.

[Kouger]

I have never been attacked, thank God, but I could imagine the anger of a man who has just been attacked at gunpoint. He must have been outraged and decided to "get him".


Well approx. 10 years ago I was attacked.. 2 men beat the hell outta me...not only did they beat me..they used a 2X4 on me..a china hutch ( was trash day) an kicked me in my stomach....chest.face..and head....long story short...... 2 broke ribs.....2 cracked ribs....cuts.scrapes.bruises couple of knife cuts ( thank god they missed stabbing me).....took over 4 months to heal all the bad things that happened......and yes...after.if i would hav been able to and been arms...i would hav gone after them........oh...all this.over 6 bucks in my pocket which they didnt get......... NOT ONE person in the area came out to help or see......real nice city

[razzsr]

[quote="Kouger"]yes...after.if i would hav been able to and been arms...i would hav gone after them..

Lucky for them you were not. You are a VERY good shooter.
Glad you made it.

Hang in there.
NEVER GIVE UP

[Kouger]

thanks...I am an average shooter at best...grin