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  1. #31
    MGO Member luckless's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flash-hider View Post
    By your research is, "shall not be infringed" in jeopardy.
    Yes. That is the strategy. Change the meaning of the word and you change the constitution. It is why they teach our kids that the constitution is a living document that changes as society changes. If they support racist policy, all they have to do is get us to agree on a new definition of racism and viola, what they do is no longer racist. Want to attack the family and church, just change the definition of family and church. They have already done it with "milita" and have used it quite successfully.
    Last edited by luckless; 03-26-2017 at 07:08 PM.

  2. #32
    MGO Member Roundballer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flash-hider View Post
    By your research is, "shall not be infringed" in jeopardy.
    In my personal opinion, substituting the word "may" for "shall" does not change the meaning of that sentence. It is an unlimited directive towards GOVERNMENT denying them permission to enact any law that infringes on a specific right. MAY not or SHALL not both deny permission.


    Life Member, NRA, Lapeer County Sportsmen's Club Disclaimer: I Am Not A Lawyer. Opinions expressed are not representative of any organization to which I may belong, and are solely mine. Any natural person or legal entity reading this post accepts all responsibility for any actions undertaken by that person or entity, based upon what they perceived was contained in this post, and shall hold harmless this poster, his antecedents, and descendants, in perpetuity.

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roundballer View Post
    In my personal opinion, substituting the word "may" for "shall" does not change the meaning of that sentence. It is an unlimited directive towards GOVERNMENT denying them permission to enact any law that infringes on a specific right. MAY not or SHALL not both deny permission.
    For me using the word "may" gives a option of choice for an action. If I would want to be more limiting and more direct I would use the word "shall" as the directive to my intentions.

  4. #34
    MGO Member Roundballer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flash-hider View Post
    For me using the word "may" gives a option of choice for an action. If I would want to be more limiting and more direct I would use the word "shall" as the directive to my intentions.
    I would agree that "shall" has a stronger sound than "may", but the next word is "not". "Shall not" and "may not" are pretty much synonymous. Try switching it to "will not" and see how it reads. All three, just end up with an absolute denial of permission.

    This is just a discussion on semantics, syntax. We won't be changing the 2nd amendment anytime soon. And the intent of the 2nd Amendment remains as denying the government (at all levels) the authority or power to regulate "arms".


    Life Member, NRA, Lapeer County Sportsmen's Club Disclaimer: I Am Not A Lawyer. Opinions expressed are not representative of any organization to which I may belong, and are solely mine. Any natural person or legal entity reading this post accepts all responsibility for any actions undertaken by that person or entity, based upon what they perceived was contained in this post, and shall hold harmless this poster, his antecedents, and descendants, in perpetuity.

  5. #35
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    I believe there is definitely a difference between "Shall" and "May"

    this is a good article on the word shall vs may.

    differencebetween.net/language/grammar-language/differences-between-shall-and-may-in-english-grammar/

  6. #36
    MGO Member Roundballer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by frmathiasen View Post
    I believe there is definitely a difference between "Shall" and "May"

    this is a good article on the word shall vs may.

    differencebetween.net/language/grammar-language/differences-between-shall-and-may-in-english-grammar/
    That is very nice and all, but when SCOTUS says that it can be interpreted either way, all the grammar lessons in the world won't change what happens in court.

    And even by your example, the use of the word "shall" does not always make something compulsory.


    Life Member, NRA, Lapeer County Sportsmen's Club Disclaimer: I Am Not A Lawyer. Opinions expressed are not representative of any organization to which I may belong, and are solely mine. Any natural person or legal entity reading this post accepts all responsibility for any actions undertaken by that person or entity, based upon what they perceived was contained in this post, and shall hold harmless this poster, his antecedents, and descendants, in perpetuity.

  7. #37
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    From what I've seen of goverment legal jargan ie codebooks (I'm an electrician) Shall always means you must do and May indicates that you have a choice.

  8. #38
    MGO Member Roundballer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mittenman View Post
    From what I've seen of goverment legal jargan ie codebooks (I'm an electrician) Shall always means you must do and May indicates that you have a choice.
    And what is the past tense of "shall"?


    Life Member, NRA, Lapeer County Sportsmen's Club Disclaimer: I Am Not A Lawyer. Opinions expressed are not representative of any organization to which I may belong, and are solely mine. Any natural person or legal entity reading this post accepts all responsibility for any actions undertaken by that person or entity, based upon what they perceived was contained in this post, and shall hold harmless this poster, his antecedents, and descendants, in perpetuity.

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roundballer View Post
    And what is the past tense of "shall"?
    "did"?
    DISCLAIMER: Disclaimer. The opinions expressed in this post are those of the author, DrScaryGuy. They do not purport to reflect the opinions or views of MGO, its board of directors, or its members.

  10. #40
    MGO Member 71commander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JasonJ View Post
    I'm even good with duty to inform (I'd do it out of courtesy in most cases anyhow),
    And what happens when you're in a vehicle with someone that you DON"T want to know that you carry a gun?
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    Private firearm instructions

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