My Homeland Defense cache.

[lee]

My homeland defense cache consists of ------------sorry no Pix's

Russian VEPR K --heavy barreled AK with Red Dot sights in 7.62 X 39

[Batman]

My homeland defense cache consists of ...

Nothing but a phone number to the local PD. I don't own a gun and am gong to totally rely on our wonderful system of democracy to protect me. I mean, isn't that what goverment is suppose to do? So why would anyone need a gun? :wink:

[Maranatha]

Batman...... its January 1st not April 1st.

[RSF]

yes buy a good ar -15 and run it in a class and learn to fight with it! there is nothing wrong with the ar -15 family period i trust my life to one every day and night! please lee give me the ideas why you dislike the 15! so much! not being combative just wondering

[bassplayer]

Currently, my homeland defense is the AR-15 :D

[lee]

yes buy a good ar -15 and run it in a class and learn to fight with it! there is nothing wrong with the ar -15 family period i trust my life to one every day and night! please lee give me the ideas why you dislike the 15! so much! not being combative just wondering


Deputy: I will try to answer your question. The M16 /AR15 is a religon to many. Some have an afinity to it because it was the rifle they learned to shoot on ie. the same as a first car and their allegience to that brand like GM, Ford , etc. My first gun was my mini 14----I could not afford an AR 15 some 20 years ago. I'm an engineer and I study the actions of all my guns----I want to understand how they work. As you know, The m16 design has always been a controversial gun .

I will say this ---------A quality built M16/AR15 is a reliable gun if properly maintained by a knowledgable user. But-----------------------------------------------------I simple do not like the design. With its short gas port dumping into the breech is to me like some one ******** either into or near ones mouth. :shock: The designer Eugene Stoner stated that he preferred the now called M96 that he also designed and was used by special forces in Vietnam. Robinson Arms makes this rifle in Utah and is well received. The designer himself pushed for M96 to be adopted.

To me a close tolerance precision rifle such as the AR!15 just begs for problems in a very dirty environment. Ergonnomically the AR is a dream and feels very natural in my short frame. Accuracy is excellent. The 223 round is another discussion but there is many complaints about stopping power on non armored people. As you have stated inyour classes----sometimes a bullets stopping power can't stop a drug , hate , mean ,adrenaline , determined individual.

The AR rifles are not even close in numbers to two other popular battle rifles. The AK is king of the hill with the FN being number two in the amount produced and currently used as batlle rifles in the world today. With that said, I should really learn how to handle these rifles due to their numbers available in the USA in a SHTF scenerio.

As I see over and over and isdiscussed at the AK-47 forumn , US soldiers in IRAQ and Afganistan are using AK's. There are whole squads using them. The individual soldier have to qualify with them and have their CO 's ok. They use them for one reason--------dependability and heck there's more ammo available. I work in health care and I've read VA documents stating that there is about 3500 amputees from IRAQ. The 7.62X39 ammo doesn't penetrate helmets and modern amor but sure does blow off limbs in a spray and pray attack. VA documents plan for 5000 amps and they are setting budgets to this number for long term care. The AK-74 round is just as nasty as the SS109 223 and has much better accuracy and range than the AK 47.

If I bought an AR, I would get a Lauer lcw 15 but at 1150.00$ I think I'd just get a M-96 that also uses the same magazine and has a conventional gas system that can run a whole lot longer without meticulous cleaning. By the way FN ---------the Belgian company that produces the Fn FAL , the SAW M-249 is building the M16a2 in South Carolina for our military. Only Colt and FN are supplying them to the USMilitary

Deputy, I have a predjudice against them. It may be irrational. I want a gun that goes boom every time no matter how dirty they can get. My SAR 1 is a piece of crap but it works and works and works. I had the FCG trigger group twist in the frame --ready to fall out and it still fired and fired. I put a quality RSA adjustable trigger in it and now the trigger doesn't twist in the frame and has improved my accuarcy.

What I have read the Isreal Galil 223. and the Finish SAKo 223 are the best modern AK action NATO firing round rifles available. They are said to be just as accurate as an AR but with AK dependability and less cleaning . Political considreations caused Isreal to adopt the M16----why because you and I and all of us Americans bought them and they got them as a part of our yearly aid packages to this country.

So , Deputy. I guess I'm just a bigot and am predjudice against AR's . But Like Britney Spears, a tricked out M4 is one damn sexy thing---doesn't mean I would want a long term commitment with em---they're both high maintenance :shock: :D

[RSF]

lol i love it! good points les for sure! i had am-96 for a while good gun for sure me iwould grab an m1a socom first and foremost! but until then iam biased onmy ar it hasnt failed me yet and my sporter lightweight survived gunsight with out a hitch and the d&l sports match and class in wyoming it has never failed me yet! until so i will countinue to be a bigot! lol! i had a few mini's back in the day never carred for there accuracy but they worked! good enough for minute of people though

[Wesley w/Glock]

I don't own any guns at all and think they are evil. If a crook kills or ravages me or my family then it is the government's fault and it will feel bad and... "feel my pain."
:barf:

However, if I were to own a gun I think I would like an AK. The communists have always had a no-nonsense approach to warfare and firearms. They rely on numbers and simplicity everywhere. Consider also ammunition. What does a case of 7.62x39 rounds cost for the AR? Maybe $180. For the AK you can use the cheap steel cased Wolf ammo and pick it up at Cabellas for $80 a case. :D

[Quaamik]

M-14 (off brand). It's more accurate than I am, utterly reliable, and no-one sneezes at the .308 / 7.62x51 for stopping power. And as a bonus it will shoot through most cars. :)

M1 Thompson (.45 ACP), M1 Carbine (.30 carbine), M-500 Mossberg (12 gauge) and M-1917 Enfield (.30-06) as backup (in order).

[Meta4]

I've got two battle rifles. The first is a cheap OlyArms AR-15, which I intend to replace with a "serious" AR-15 within the next 12-16 months as finances permit.

I also have a Marlin .30-30 lever action with a scope and bipod which would be useful if things `hit the fan' but an "evil rifle" like an AR-15 would be too obvious. If I needed to make a cross-country trek while remaining as low-key as possible, the .30-30 would probably win out over the AR. After all, and AR-15 is a "tool of terrorists," while a lever-action looks like "grampa's deer gun" to the average joe.

Perception is everything.

-James

[Darkmind]

Lest see hear, where do I start.

1 Late 1950s era SA M1 grand with 1k rounds. All on en bloc clips

1 Colt made M4 with 1k rounds and two loaded beta C mags.

1 Mossy 590A1 ( waiting on some parts to "trick it out") with 250 rounds 00 and 250 rounds of 7/8 oz slugger.

1 Glock model 23 with about 1k rounds of Gold dot.

1 1943 Colt made 1911, US army issue with a few hundred rounds of hardball .45.

1 FN five & seven pistol, 15 20 round mags, and about 1k rounds of ss192.

And I'm also on a waiting list for a P90. And planing on picking up a large amount of 50 round mags for it.

I have more but those are the only ones that I would consider using for Homeland defense.

[lee]

Darkmind : You obviously have an "aresenal" and should be reported to the "authorities". You must be paranoid and not trust your government. Its people like you that give law abiding sport hunters a bad name. Its about "duck Hunting" stupid not protecting your arse and the constitution. Do you really think your pea shooter can stop the high tech overwhelming force of the US or foreign military? Just look at Iraq?


OK , Ok, well Those pesky " insurgents" are causing a BIG headache with their IED's and small arms.----Poker face off------- Darkmind: thats a good collection you have there but you need some big stuff like a Barret .50 to address "special needs".

A P-90.wow. I just love that blond babe with the P90 on Stargate-- :shock: Does she come with the gun? :shock: :shock: :twisted:

[USA Patriot]

Lee:

While I don't agree 100%, your points are well taken. If you want a true 'homeland' SHTF rifle battery, an AR15 clone is a must IMHO. Plenty of homegrown ammo, plenty of parts, the good guys (like deputy) who we will be counting on to help us will have what we need in these departments when necessary and in quantity.

That having been said, I have seen enough cheap AR clones in my time to walk away unimpressed. If an AK clone is done badly, it still tends to run like a clock (a dirty, inaccurate clock -- but at least you know what time it is within a 1/2 hour or so!! LOL). It has those 'third world' tolerences and manuf. methods in mind during design that the AR series never had.

SO.... you are back to either:
A: A decent amount of labor on your part to make sure your frankenAR is put together well, parts checked for tolerences, and some TLC. This is not THAT hard, but if you want things done right...
OR
B: Get an expensive (compared to AK) AR. Colt and Bushmaster, right out of the box are my only options. I have heard good things about others, but personally, the devil you know...

If you just want ammo compatibility with domestic good guys (I would consider this a minimum requirement), then get one of the many AK clones that run on 5.56. They are modestly priced and the controls are familar to the AK user.

[Darkmind]

Darkmind : You obviously have an "aresenal" and should be reported to the "authorities". You must be paranoid and not trust your government. Its people like you that give law abiding sport hunters a bad name. Its about "duck Hunting" stupid not protecting your arse and the constitution. Do you really think your pea shooter can stop the high tech overwhelming force of the US or foreign military? Just look at Iraq?


OK , Ok, well Those pesky " insurgents" are causing a BIG headache with their IED's and small arms.----Poker face off------- Darkmind: thats a good collection you have there but you need some big stuff like a Barret .50 to address "special needs".

A P-90.wow. I just love that blond babe with the P90 on Stargate-- :shock: Does she come with the gun? :shock: :shock: :twisted:


You had me going there for a min Lee. LOL

A collection is just what it is. When I purchase a firearm the last thing I'm thinking about is a SHTF situation. I buy with collecting in mind and unfortunately I'm going broke because of it. I keep a very large amount of ammo on hand because I shoot 2 to 3 times a week. A lot of the time I also take a few of the "uneducated" people that I know and educate them on how to properly handle, shoot, and care for a firearm. So needless to say I go threw a LOT of ammo, I also consider ammo as one of my monthly bills LOL.

As far as the Barret .50 M82A1 goes, that is in the works as we speak. It's still a long way off considering I don't have 10 grand just laying around LOL.

[dpgperftest]

My homeland defense cache consists of ...

Nothing but a phone number to the local PD. I don't own a gun and am gong to totally rely on our wonderful system of democracy to protect me. I mean, isn't that what goverment is suppose to do? So why would anyone need a gun? :wink:


:yeahthat: :yeahthat: :yeahthat: :yeahthat: :yeahthat: :yeahthat: :yeahthat: :yeahthat:

my self only a lil 9mm with 50 RNDS

[HVYMTLMEC]

You do realize this post is like 4+ years old right?

[postban]

:yeahthat: :yeahthat: :yeahthat: :yeahthat: :yeahthat: :yeahthat: :yeahthat: :yeahthat:

my self only a lil 9mm with 50 RNDS


:fur3:

[chuknduk]

:fur3:
Whats wrong with that??????? Maybe he/she should have just started a NEW post with the SAME topic. I guess I better be careful if I search for a topic and actually have something to say...it might be too OLD.:shake:

[tote'ngranny]

Whats wrong with that??????? Maybe he/she should have just started a NEW post with the SAME topic. I guess I better be careful if I search for a topic and actually have something to say...it might be too OLD.:shake:
I saw this last night and the guy has been dredging up maaannnyy old posts, some going back 5 YEARS. That is called spamming. Look what he replied with on these posts. Look up his profile and read the replies... absolutely pointless.

[chuknduk]

I agree that people shouldn't post useless comments, but I thought the idea of a forum like this was to share/discuss topics that are relevant. AGE of the original post shouldn't matter. Enough said, beating a dead horse here.

[dpgperftest]

:fur3:


warning Zombie Threads

[tote'ngranny]

I agree that people shouldn't post useless comments, but I thought the idea of a forum like this was to share/discuss topics that are relevant. AGE of the original post shouldn't matter. Enough said, beating a dead horse here.
You need to read all of his replies....:scratch: they add nothing to the topics.

[dpgperftest]

I agree that people shouldn't post useless comments, but I thought the idea of a forum like this was to share/discuss topics that are relevant. AGE of the original post shouldn't matter. Enough said, beating a dead horse here.


be nice whats not relevant to you maybe relevant to someone 8-)

[dpgperftest]

You need to read all of his replies....:scratch: they add nothing to the topics.


be nice whats not relevant to you maybe relevant to someone :spank:

[dpgperftest]

I shot a freands M14/M1A thats a DAM good Rifel and a AK-47 both nice but i have to say I liked his M-14/M1A the best .:ak2:

Does anyone know off hand what a M1A/M14 costs ????????

[mechredd]

My homeland defense cache consists of a few guns that I've mentioned on the boards here and allot that I didn't because I don't want Obama to know how many of what that I have. That way he'll never be able to totally disarm me!

Ah ***** I just realized that the tinfoil wasn't completely covering my head. I just fixed it and I can think clearly now. What was I saying?

[dpgperftest]

My homeland defense cache consists of a few guns that I've mentioned on the boards here and allot that I didn't because I don't want Obama to know how many of what that I have. That way he'll never be able to to tally disarm me!

Ah ***** I just realized that the tinfoil wasn't completely covering my head. I just fixed it and I can think clearly now. What was I saying?

I think it was something like you voted for him .LOL LOL just kidding that was mean sorry

[wombat12]

Here are my thoughts on a Homeland Defence/SHTF cache:

1) 22lr revolver. Short range small game, last resort short range defense.

2) 22lr bolt action rifle with scope. Small game, practice, close in defense.

3) Easy to carry 9MM pistol. Something to wear while doing chores where carrying a rifle is not practical. Backup on scouting and hunting expeditions.

4)EBR. Scouting expeditions, hunting, medium range defense. Personally prefer the AK platform for it's reliability. With plenty of ammo and a quart of motor oil, you're good to go for a long time.

5) Heavy barrel .308 with scope. Long range defense and still hunting.

6) 12 ga pump. Not a bad idea to have both short and 28" barrel. Close to medium defense. Hunting.

Unfortunately, since the boating accident, ...........

[johnzilla]

3) Easy to carry .45ACP pistol. Something to wear while doing chores where carrying a rifle is not practical. Backup on scouting and hunting expeditions.


Fixed it for you. ;)

[wombat12]

Fixed it for you. ;)

The reason I chose 9mm over a .45ACP was less recoil in a lightweight pistol. Besides myself, would be used by petite wife and teen daughter. Yes they could learn to shoot it, but would take time.

[dpgperftest]

Here are my thoughts on a Homeland Defence/SHTF cache:

1) 22lr revolver. Short range small game, last resort short range defense.

2) 22lr bolt action rifle with scope. Small game, practice, close in defense.

3) Easy to carry 9MM pistol. Something to wear while doing chores where carrying a rifle is not practical. Backup on scouting and hunting expeditions.

4)EBR. Scouting expeditions, hunting, medium range defense. Personally prefer the AK platform for it's reliability. With plenty of ammo and a quart of motor oil, you're good to go for a long time.

5) Heavy barrel .308 with scope. Long range defense and still hunting.

6) 12 ga pump. Not a bad idea to have both short and 28" barrel. Close to medium defense. Hunting.

Unfortunately, since the boating accident, ...........

well hell i lost the bout toooo