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kdogg
09-08-2011, 08:31 PM
I'd almost be curious to see a list of people and their cities/counties.

Curious to know about Wyoming, Michigan. For those of us who don't have $400.00 for an NFA Trust that is.

Phelptwan
09-08-2011, 08:37 PM
I'd almost be curious to see a list of people and their cities/counties.

Curious to know about Wyoming, Michigan. For those of us who don't have $400.00 for an NFA Trust that is.

Dick Fuller in Kalamazoo County says no. Then again, this is the guy who I asked what he thought about concealed weapons permits and responded with "I'm not sure yet how I feel about private firearm ownership".

kdogg
09-08-2011, 09:04 PM
Here is what I don't get...

If you come in for a sign off, they know WHO you are. They know you've GOT the things. On the flip side, NFA trust, they don't know a dang thing.

Seems like they would want to sign off just to keep tabs on people.

Joeywhat
09-08-2011, 09:07 PM
You DO realize you can set up a trust for much cheaper? You don't HAVE to pay a lawyer to do it.

pgaplayerless
09-08-2011, 09:09 PM
Here is what I don't get...

If you come in for a sign off, they know WHO you are. They know you've GOT the things. On the flip side, NFA trust, they don't know a dang thing.

Seems like they would want to sign off just to keep tabs on people.

Not really. They know you might have the things.

Just because CLEO signed off doesnt mean ATF didnt reject u

kdogg
09-08-2011, 09:13 PM
You DO realize you can set up a trust for much cheaper? You don't HAVE to pay a lawyer to do it.

Eh, not sure I trust myself to do that though! Almost rather have a lawyer backing over the do it yourself route. Maybe I'll be more comfortable as reports of other fellow MGO'ers getting it figured out come rolling in.


Not really. They know you might have the things.

Just because CLEO signed off doesnt mean ATF didnt reject u

Well you know what I meant though.

ColonelKurtz
09-08-2011, 09:18 PM
They know you've GOT the things.
You think they don't know you have things when you drop off an RI-60 or two (or twenty)?

I plan to move ASAP anyway, and I'll tell them that, too. The local CLEOs won't know a thing whether it's somewhere else in Michigan or another MG loving (tolerating) state.

harry
09-08-2011, 09:21 PM
I am thinking that my cleo will sign :banana: "Noise suppressors are a useful tool for Michigan firearms enthusiasts and the rigorous federal licensing process serves as a safeguard to ensure only law-abiding citizens can be in possession," Marquette County Sheriff Michael Lovelace.

Sheridanarmsllc
09-08-2011, 09:24 PM
Schedule a meeting with your local CLEO before paperwork ends up on their desk. If they still wont sign, then the trust is your next best option if you don't have another CLEO that is friendly in your jurisdiction.

You may pay a few extra dollars up front, but the whole process will become easier during several transfers if you plan to own more than 1 NFA item in a trust.

I've been transferring Class 3 items for 10 years in the state, and this seems to work best in my experience.

djs
09-09-2011, 04:40 PM
The trust you refer to - is it a generic living trust or something more specific?

kdogg
09-09-2011, 09:22 PM
Schedule a meeting with your local CLEO before paperwork ends up on their desk. If they still wont sign, then the trust is your next best option if you don't have another CLEO that is friendly in your jurisdiction.

You may pay a few extra dollars up front, but the whole process will become easier during several transfers if you plan to own more than 1 NFA item in a trust.

I've been transferring Class 3 items for 10 years in the state, and this seems to work best in my experience.

Well ideally I want a Silencerco Sparrow .22LR suppressor, an Osprey .45acp suppressor so I can use it on my .45acp and my 9mm and something for a 5.56 (Surefire maybe?) but right now I just want a damn .22LR suppressor and it's looking like $1000.00+ to get setup to own that unless I can get a sign off. :(

SSG3K
09-10-2011, 12:57 AM
Revocable living trust, about 35 dollars and a little time. Buy software online fill it out go to notary pay 10dollars and you are on your way. Go to class 3 dealer fondle your chit and wait months. Get phone call and have some fun. In a nutshell.

Rich

Quaamik
09-10-2011, 01:03 PM
Dick Fuller in Kalamazoo County says no. Then again, this is the guy who I asked what he thought about concealed weapons permits and responded with "I'm not sure yet how I feel about private firearm ownership".

I wonder what his response would be if you scheduled an appointment with him and asked for his signoff on the NFA forms and when he refused, just said:

"Oh well, I was hoping to avoid having to pay the $45 to set up a trust to purchase these. But since you won't even consider signing them, I'll just go that route. Don't worry, I wont have to bother you again for this or any future purchases of NFA items once the trust is set up."

If possible, time it for while he's taking a sip of coffee :)

rjrivero
09-10-2011, 01:53 PM
I wonder what his response would be if you scheduled an appointment with him and asked for his signoff on the NFA forms and when he refused, just said:

"Oh well, I was hoping to avoid having to pay the $45 to set up a trust to purchase these. But since you won't even consider signing them, I'll just go that route. Don't worry, I wont have to bother you again for this or any future purchases of NFA items once the trust is set up."

If possible, time it for while he's taking a sip of coffee :)
In all likelihood, the sheriff wouldn't bat an eye. The fact is, the sheriff is an elected official. If he perceives that his re-election chances are hampered by being labeled as the sheriff who distributes "machine guns and assassin suppressors" then he's not going to sign them.

The time for CLEO signoffs has come and gone. Hopefully, they'll be gone for good sooner rather than later.

harley2003rkc
09-10-2011, 02:05 PM
Burton Chief of Police had no issues signing off my Form 4 for MG a couple months ago. My advice is that when you go in your paper work, take a third copy to leave with him. My chief keeps a running file of all the FFL/NFA paper work that he's signed off on, and he appreciated the double sided copy I left with him.

Shyster
09-10-2011, 03:02 PM
Revocable living trust, about 35 dollars and a little time. Buy software online fill it out go to notary pay 10dollars and you are on your way. Go to class 3 dealer fondle your chit and wait months. Get phone call and have some fun. In a nutshell.

Rich
Not that simple. Yes, you might be able to purchase it that way but under certain conditions that trust could end up voided and you would have a rather large problem.

Tyler
09-10-2011, 03:35 PM
Not that simple. Yes, you might be able to purchase it that way but under certain conditions that trust could end up voided and you would have a rather large problem.


I think I'd trust shyster on this one! I'd rather be safe than sorry.

fragged
09-10-2011, 09:15 PM
Just a reminder, CLEO of your jurisdiction goes from the chief in your city all the way up to the governor of your state, with all the sheriffs, MSP, and I believe DA's as well on your way there.

Also, carry two forms, the form 4 and another drafted for for if they will not sign the form 4. Tell them it is for "records".

Ensure to inform them that you meant the NRA's records. Better than just letting them say no because they are *****s.


Side Note: Because my time and aggravation is worth it, I am getting a trust set up...F' em.

rjrivero
09-10-2011, 09:34 PM
Just a reminder, CLEO of your jurisdiction goes from the chief in your city all the way up to the governor of your state, with all the sheriffs, MSP, and I believe DA's as well on your way there.

Also, carry two forms, the form 4 and another drafted for for if they will not sign the form 4. Tell them it is for "records".

Ensure to inform them that you meant the NRA's records. Better than just letting them say no because they are *****s.


Side Note: Because my time and aggravation is worth it, I am getting a trust set up...F' em.

You need to send the form 4's to the ATF in Duplicate. Each with original IN INK signatures. If they don't SIGN the form's then what's the point of bringing "extras?"

dreidel13
09-11-2011, 01:14 AM
So when we say CLEO does that mean the chief of police for my city can sign or does it need to be the sheriff? Or the ranking state police officer? Or can any of them sign?

ZYA_LTR
09-11-2011, 12:00 PM
You need to send the form 4's to the ATF in Duplicate. Each with original IN INK signatures. If they don't SIGN the form's then what's the point of bringing "extras?"


He is saying, to have an alternate form....drawn up by yourslef with a simple statement saying that "I____________ police chief of blah blah city/county will not be willing to sign off on any form 4's for the purpose of legal suppressor ownership in michigan" or something to that effect. Then just kindly inform the officer whom you pay the salary of, that this form is simply to be used for "records" with the NRA as you will be forwarding ot off to them to inform others that are interested in legal suppressor ownership that he is against it and to just set up a trust to bypass the rejection.

I think

AMX
09-12-2011, 10:48 AM
Sheriff Koops in Allegan county signed mine for my Halo. For anyone in Allegan county, contact Lt. Frank Baker and he will get the paperwork to the sheriff.

jts_01
09-12-2011, 04:40 PM
Does anyone have any experience with Troy PD and sign off's?...I'm almost scared to walk in there and even ask considering some of the draconian laws we have here (ie: no drinking water while driving) If not Troy, perhaps Oakland? I'm sure others would be interested as well...

detroit25
10-06-2011, 09:18 AM
So if I am understanding this correctly the biggest reason to get a trust is to avoid a LEO signature?

miked
10-06-2011, 09:39 AM
So if I am understanding this correctly the biggest reason to get a trust is to avoid a LEO signature?


By my understanding you can also name multiuple trustee's and designate beneficieries for the item. That could be usefull for maintaining the item in your family/group if something happens to you or if you want to be able to share it with a few others.

Shyster
10-06-2011, 10:53 AM
So if I am understanding this correctly the biggest reason to get a trust is to avoid a LEO signature?
That is one benefit but even more important is the fact that, if purchased by an individual it must only be used AND POSSESSED by that person. If a Trust owns it anyone listed as a Trust Beneficiary can use and possess it.

AND you can add/change Trust Beneficiaries without too much difficulty.

Toxie
10-15-2011, 05:32 PM
Livonia interim chief signed.

ColonelKurtz
10-16-2011, 09:05 AM
I wonder what his response would be if you scheduled an appointment with him and asked for his signoff on the NFA forms and when he refused, just said:

"Oh well, I was hoping to avoid having to pay the $45 to set up a trust to purchase these. But since you won't even consider signing them, I'll just go that route. Don't worry, I wont have to bother you again for this or any future purchases of NFA items once the trust is set up."
After two weeks of no response, that's what I ended up saying. Had them signed and in my hands the next day.