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METL
09-29-2011, 12:50 PM
What are people's opinions on mexican carry with a grip safety? I'm planning on getting a holster, but I"m having a little trouble finding one just yet... just wanted to bounce that off people... I would think the only real problem would be 'holstering' the firearm... one would have to be very careful with that... but I tried it out (cleared) and it's a TIGHT fit on my hip (just like IWB at 3-4 o'clock but no holster) and the gun has a grip safety as well as a trigger safety....

2+ heads are better than one, so I figured I'd ask the question.


Thanks.

miked
09-29-2011, 12:53 PM
I would not carry that way. Still too many possible things to go wrong, grip safety or no.

MichiganShootist
09-29-2011, 01:00 PM
There are many---many--- things that can go wrong using "Mexican" carry

- Gun dropping out of belt
- Gun dropping down inside pants
- Front sight catching on clothes or belt when you try to draw
- Increased opportunity to have your pistol snatched
- Hammer (if it has one) catching on clothing
- Magazine release being depressed by belt or clothing
- Gun being out of position or angle when you want to draw
- Thumb safety (if it has one) being deactivated by belt or clothing


On----and---On

Tom Fineis
09-29-2011, 01:03 PM
What type of pistol?

METL
09-29-2011, 02:52 PM
There are many---many--- things that can go wrong using "Mexican" carry

- Gun dropping out of belt
- Gun dropping down inside pants
- Front sight catching on clothes or belt when you try to draw
- Increased opportunity to have your pistol snatched
- Hammer (if it has one) catching on clothing
- Magazine release being depressed by belt or clothing
- Gun being out of position or angle when you want to draw
- Thumb safety (if it has one) being deactivated by belt or clothing


On----and---On


The BOLDED ones are good ones... thanks for the help. I hadn't considered them.

As far as dropping out, it is TIGHT and the handle goes over top of my belt, so that wouldn't be an issue... I don't think coming OUT would be either unless it was VERY vigorous activity.

Striker fired... no thumb safety (trigger and grip safeties) and the angle is actually really good for my draw.

I'm thinking I won't be doing it though.





What type of pistol?


XD40sc


I guess I probably won't do it... and this is exactly why I asked the question... I knew people would bring up some things I had not considered. Thanks people...

Tom Fineis
09-29-2011, 03:22 PM
XD40sc


I have a solution (http://www.ravenconcealmentsystems.com/product_info.php?cPath=82_97_119&products_id=1617) for you.

Front sights and mag releases catching on clothing is a non-issue.

JohnJak
09-29-2011, 03:40 PM
Loose weight and carry at your desecration.

TomE
09-29-2011, 03:58 PM
What are people's opinions on mexican carry with a grip safety? I'm planning on getting a holster, but I"m having a little trouble finding one just yet... just wanted to bounce that off people... I would think the only real problem would be 'holstering' the firearm... one would have to be very careful with that... but I tried it out (cleared) and it's a TIGHT fit on my hip (just like IWB at 3-4 o'clock but no holster) and the gun has a grip safety as well as a trigger safety....

2+ heads are better than one, so I figured I'd ask the question.


Thanks.

Thats racist , do you think the Mexicans don't have rights or feelings??:pepsi:

METL
09-29-2011, 04:23 PM
I have a solution (http://www.ravenconcealmentsystems.com/product_info.php?cPath=82_97_119&products_id=1617) for you.

Front sights and mag releases catching on clothing is a non-issue.


Oh man... that is sweet!!!! I think that might be the trick...

I purchased this today: Desantis invisible agent

http://tinyurl.com/63s2muc


But it kinda sucks... (for me) it's tuckable, which is cool, but it doesn't have the right cant for me.... (for sale if anyone wants it... :) left handed $20 shipped) IT's more meant for appendix carry I think...





Loose weight and carry at your description.

I don't know what this means.. I weigh 180 and wear size 33 pants.. fit is not an issue.. fit of the GUN, in the holster is my main issue at this point.


Thats racist , do you think the Mexicans don't have rights or feelings??:pepsi:



LoL :D

TomE
09-29-2011, 05:05 PM
Oh man... that is sweet!!!! I think that might be the trick...

I purchased this today: Desantis invisible agent

http://tinyurl.com/63s2muc


But it kinda sucks... (for me) it's tuckable, which is cool, but it doesn't have the right cant for me.... (for sale if anyone wants it... :) left handed $20 shipped) IT's more meant for appendix carry I think...






I don't know what this means.. I weigh 180 and wear size 33 pants.. fit is not an issue.. fit of the GUN, in the holster is my main issue at this point.





LoL :D

I got some Hispanics across the street ,should I ask them about Mexican Carry?

CrimDoc
09-29-2011, 05:20 PM
IMHO there's one more good reason NOT to Mexican carry: it makes you look like a thug.

Now ... many people will probably flame me for saying that. Your response will be: "So what? It's not illegal, and it's my right to carry any way I want."

Yes, it is. But should something "go wrong" ... an AD, a "marginal" self defense shooting, a bad encounter with a LEO, anything ... the more you LOOK like a "bad guy" (or at least an irresponsible Cowboy) ... the more likely a LEO or prosecutor is to "charge you with something (anything) and let the courts sort it out."

Is that worth it? Just to carry in a way that really offers no good tactical advantage?

METL
09-29-2011, 07:10 PM
I got some Hispanics across the street ,should I ask them about Mexican Carry?

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-JETgaxYIvDE/TaTBgNmtC2I/AAAAAAAAA38/VXMkesToH7Y/s1600/NotSureIfSerious.jpg

Mexican carry is explained here... not a racial issue. Like saying italian bread is racist. :)

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0BQY/is_2_51/ai_n8591504/




IMHO there's one more good reason NOT to Mexican carry: it makes you look like a thug.

Now ... many people will probably flame me for saying that. Your response will be: "So what? It's not illegal, and it's my right to carry any way I want."

Yes, it is. But should something "go wrong" ... an AD, a "marginal" self defense shooting, a bad encounter with a LEO, anything ... the more you LOOK like a "bad guy" (or at least an irresponsible Cowboy) ... the more likely a LEO or prosecutor is to "charge you with something (anything) and let the courts sort it out."

Is that worth it? Just to carry in a way that really offers no good tactical advantage?


Well the gun I'm talking about carrying as such would be a backup to my OCd full size gun... so it would only be used in a gun grab situation or if my strong arm was being controlled... additionally, if there was a malfunction of my primary, or if the SHTF and I had to arm someone else...

So I don't think people would get the "thug" vibe.. especially from a guy like me... but I understand what you're talking about.

The advantage of carrying as such is I can't find a comfortable holster and want to carry the back up anyways.

Tom Fineis
09-29-2011, 07:29 PM
If you can wait a few weeks, I'll have something perfect for your situation.

METL
09-29-2011, 08:32 PM
If you can wait a few weeks, I'll have something perfect for your situation.


Whachu got in mind? I can mexi-carry for a bit. :) Though the vanguard looks pretty ideal... though I don't know what I would tie the paracord to.. well, I can think of ONE thing... but I'm not tying it to that. :wow: :D

Leader
09-29-2011, 09:37 PM
CrossBreed Super Tuck.

jeepinrrt
09-29-2011, 10:43 PM
Whachu got in mind? I can mexi-carry for a bit. :) Though the vanguard looks pretty ideal... though I don't know what I would tie the paracord to.. well, I can think of ONE thing... but I'm not tying it to that. :wow: :D

Adjacent belt loop....

That way you keep all your original equipment intact.

METL
09-30-2011, 07:27 AM
Adjacent belt loop....

That way you keep all your original equipment intact.


Yeah, I was thinking that, but wasnt' sure how that would work.. I guess if the string was pretty short, that may be ok... I was just thinking that if it was tied to the belt loop you might have to chicken wing it a bit...

tom-n8ies
10-01-2011, 06:45 PM
Griffin holsters in the commercial section kind of a crossbreed supertuck clone.

t

dekova
10-01-2011, 09:53 PM
Yeah, I was thinking that, but wasnt' sure how that would work.. I guess if the string was pretty short, that may be ok... I was just thinking that if it was tied to the belt loop you might have to chicken wing it a bit...

There's a youtube video of someone demonstrating the MIC, which is essentially the same thing. Might give you an idea of how it rides, etc.

I'd post the link, but can't until I have more posts... Just go to youtube and search for "Glock MIC Universal IWB Holster "

gijoecam
10-03-2011, 08:13 AM
There's a youtube video of someone demonstrating the MIC, which is essentially the same thing. Might give you an idea of how it rides, etc.

I'd post the link, but can't until I have more posts... Just go to youtube and search for "Glock MIC Universal IWB Holster "

I would not recommend it. No matter how tight the fit, if it's tight enough to hold the gun in place, it'll become uncomfortable after a (surprisingly short) time.

Other drawbacks that come to mind are:

Potty breaks: What do you do when you need to drop trou in a public restroom without dropping the gun in the potty?

What if you need to run? Seriously... Even skampering across a busy intersection could dislodge the gun.

It's ill-advised IMHO. Even a cheap Uncle Mike's is better than nothing.

I once had an instructor tell me: To see if a holster is the right fit for you and the gun, you have to go beyond simply stuffing the gun in it and clipping it to your belt. Put it on in your living room, then do a half-dozen sit-ups, somersaults, cartwheels, and flop around like a dead fish without touching or readjusting the gun. If neither the holster nor the gun have moved after the acrobatics, it'll pass.

METL
10-03-2011, 08:36 AM
I would not recommend it. No matter how tight the fit, if it's tight enough to hold the gun in place, it'll become uncomfortable after a (surprisingly short) time.

Other drawbacks that come to mind are:

Potty breaks: What do you do when you need to drop trou in a public restroom without dropping the gun in the potty?

What if you need to run? Seriously... Even skampering across a busy intersection could dislodge the gun.

It's ill-advised IMHO. Even a cheap Uncle Mike's is better than nothing.

I once had an instructor tell me: To see if a holster is the right fit for you and the gun, you have to go beyond simply stuffing the gun in it and clipping it to your belt. Put it on in your living room, then do a half-dozen sit-ups, somersaults, cartwheels, and flop around like a dead fish without touching or readjusting the gun. If neither the holster nor the gun have moved after the acrobatics, it'll pass.



Definately didn't consider the bathroom breaks... of course #1 you can make work... but #2, you got a problem! Looks like with that MIC you can let it hang but I don't know how much I would trust or waht my pistol hanging on the end of a string.

dekova
10-03-2011, 09:51 AM
I'd been considering the MIC and thought I'd pick one up to give it a try but CrimDoc brings up a great point.


IMHO there's one more good reason NOT to Mexican carry: it makes you look like a thug.

Whoever you are (cop, storeowner, civilian), when you see someone with a gun you often have to make a judgement call with incomplete information. I think mexican carry just screams thug to some people.

RECON762WT
10-03-2011, 10:07 AM
:getsum:

Tom Fineis
10-03-2011, 10:27 AM
I'd been considering the MIC and thought I'd pick one up to give it a try but CrimDoc brings up a great point.



Why would you buy the MIC when you could buy the original (Vanguard) from an MGO supporting company, with the best warranty in the industry, and a feature built in that allows the item to be removed with one hand should the cord ever break, or you pick the gun up with the other arm injured?

It is a simple piece, but it's not as simple as just wrapping the trigger guard with Kydex. There is some R&D behind these and we're the only ones offering the ability to remove it with one hand.

Tyler
10-03-2011, 11:21 AM
Adjacent belt loop....

That way you keep all your original equipment intact.


I was thinking around the actual belt. I would hate to draw my gun and have my belt loop tear away with the vanguard still on the trigger guard.

jeepinrrt
10-03-2011, 11:23 AM
I was thinking around the actual belt. I would hate to draw my gun and have my belt loop tear away with the vanguard still on the trigger guard.

That is probably a better solution. :thumbup:

Tom Fineis
10-03-2011, 11:34 AM
I can't speak for the others, but we do NOT consider a belt loop to be an appropriate mounting option. These were designed to be wrapped around a sturdy belt.

Joeywhat
10-03-2011, 11:41 AM
Belt loops break. Quite easily, in fact.

pistoltraining
10-03-2011, 06:35 PM
How about a belt slide? I have one that can be worn inside or out, it's inexpensive and will be better than nothing until you find something. NRA has them for $20 or so.


What are people's opinions on mexican carry with a grip safety? I'm planning on getting a holster, but I"m having a little trouble finding one just yet... just wanted to bounce that off people... I would think the only real problem would be 'holstering' the firearm... one would have to be very careful with that... but I tried it out (cleared) and it's a TIGHT fit on my hip (just like IWB at 3-4 o'clock but no holster) and the gun has a grip safety as well as a trigger safety....

2+ heads are better than one, so I figured I'd ask the question.


Thanks.

METL
10-03-2011, 07:02 PM
Why would you buy the MIC when you could buy the original (Vanguard) from an MGO supporting company, with the best warranty in the industry, and a feature built in that allows the item to be removed with one hand should the cord ever break, or you pick the gun up with the other arm injured?

It is a simple piece, but it's not as simple as just wrapping the trigger guard with Kydex. There is some R&D behind these and we're the only ones offering the ability to remove it with one hand.



I'm sure dekova mean to say they were going to buy THIS.... http://www.ravenconcealmentsystems.com/product_info.php?cPath=82_97_119&products_id=1617


I'm sure they were NOT going to buy the MIC... because THIS ( http://www.ravenconcealmentsystems.com/product_info.php?cPath=82_97_119&products_id=1617 ) is much better...


Right? :D

dekova
10-03-2011, 07:56 PM
I'm sure dekova mean to say they were going to buy THIS....

I'm sure they were NOT going to buy the MIC... because THIS is much better...


Right? :D

Exactly right. Thanks for fixing that for me... good to know you've got my back!

Combat Commander
10-05-2011, 05:37 PM
The MIC has been around since 1997 I'm sure the Raven's Vanguard was first.

IMO the MIC looks like a POS.

METL
10-06-2011, 03:07 PM
The MIC has been around since 1997 I'm sure the Raven's Vanguard was first.

IMO the MIC looks like a POS.



I actually was thinking it looked like the MIC was hard to get off the pistol... I think the vanguard looks a little better...


Still wiating on that other solution Tom had for me... ;)

35percent
10-07-2011, 10:09 AM
If you can wait a few weeks, I'll have something perfect for your situation.

This. I'd like to say more, but just, yeah.




I once had an instructor tell me: To see if a holster is the right fit for you and the gun, you have to go beyond simply stuffing the gun in it and clipping it to your belt. Put it on in your living room, then do a half-dozen sit-ups, somersaults, cartwheels, and flop around like a dead fish without touching or readjusting the gun. If neither the holster nor the gun have moved after the acrobatics, it'll pass.

For me I don't find this to be true, at least for AIWB. I want the gun/holster to move around a little bit with me as I'm walking, sitting, moving around, getting in/out of my vehicle. Not so much that the positioning completely moves, but enough to where it sits comfortably and I can reliably get a fighting grip from the draw.

- Jacob

METL
10-07-2011, 02:37 PM
This. I'd like to say more, but just, yeah.



- Jacob


Now my interest is peeked... :D

Joeywhat
10-07-2011, 03:03 PM
Well, you'll be pleasantly surprised, I think.

METL
11-10-2011, 11:23 AM
If you can wait a few weeks, I'll have something perfect for your situation.



Waited a few weeks... now what? :)

Tom Fineis
11-10-2011, 11:31 AM
End of this month. Some last minute production issues had to be ironed out.

Some companies claim a date or number of units sold, but to my knowledge there is no proof of any of those claims available. The first patent for the trigger guard cover was applied for in 2006-2007 time frame, and the owner of that patent is who we license our Vanguard through. At the time RCS brought it to market, a thorough search did not turn up any other similar products being sold. The consumer is free to believe whichever timeline they want, but we have documented proof of ours.

dekova
11-10-2011, 04:05 PM
I don't know what Tom's working on, but seeing the MIC got me to working on my own solution.

I developed something that prevents you from pulling the trigger under any circumstances, I call it the MIT. I'm shopping the idea around now, don't be surprised if you see a major manufacturer producing these soon.

http://img14.imageshack.us/img14/4152/img20111110155824.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/14/img20111110155824.jpg/)

Wolvee
11-10-2011, 05:09 PM
I don't see any real issues with it if your mode of carry is sound.

http://i186.photobucket.com/albums/x95/orfeo_01/DSC_0576.jpg

http://i186.photobucket.com/albums/x95/orfeo_01/DSC_0579.jpg

http://i186.photobucket.com/albums/x95/orfeo_01/DSC_0588.jpg

Combat Commander
11-10-2011, 08:50 PM
Some companies claim a date or number of units sold, but to my knowledge there is no proof of any of those claims available. The first patent for the trigger guard cover was applied for in 2006-2007 time frame, and the owner of that patent is who we license our Vanguard through. At the time RCS brought it to market, a thorough search did not turn up any other similar products being sold. The consumer is free to believe whichever timeline they want, but we have documented proof of ours.


Do you have a Patent # ? A Patent search turned up nothing.

Tom Fineis
11-10-2011, 09:23 PM
It expired before RCS got involved.

METL
11-10-2011, 09:32 PM
I don't see any real issues with it if your mode of carry is sound.

http://i186.photobucket.com/albums/x95/orfeo_01/DSC_0576.jpg

http://i186.photobucket.com/albums/x95/orfeo_01/DSC_0579.jpg

http://i186.photobucket.com/albums/x95/orfeo_01/DSC_0588.jpg


compensating for something!??! Ahuhu... :whacko:


The USP is no small pistol either.. it really hides well there... AND the ladies tthink you have a huge package! lol

Combat Commander
11-10-2011, 09:34 PM
It expired before RCS got involved.

Thats strange Patents # last forever the Patent expires but the numbers don't.

BTW Why would RCS need to license the Vanguard through anyone if the patent is expired ?

Shay VanVlymen never held a patent.

Shayle VanVlymen holds this patent for a training bolt

http://www.uspto.gov/web/patents/patog/week48/OG/html/1360-5/US07841118-20101130.html

Tom Fineis
11-10-2011, 09:49 PM
Thats strange Patents # last forever the Patent expires but the numbers don't.

BTW Why would RCS need to license the Vanguard through anyone if the patent is expired ?

Shay VanVlymen never held a patent.

Shayle VanVlymen holds this patent for a training bolt

http://www.uspto.gov/web/patents/patog/week48/OG/html/1360-5/US07841118-20101130.html

Shay had a provisional patent and had entered an agreement with a 'big name' holster manufacturer. That manufacturer balked, the provisional patent expired, and he approached us about 6 months later.

We license it because it is the honorable thing to do.

dekova
11-10-2011, 09:54 PM
METL, two things:

How fast can you get to your gun? It hides well but I'm thinking it might be a bit slow to get to. What's your experience?
I just realized you've gotten me stare at a picture of your crotch for a good two minutes.

Combat Commander
11-10-2011, 10:04 PM
Shay had a provisional patent and had entered an agreement with a 'big name' holster manufacturer. That manufacturer balked, the provisional patent expired, and he approached us about 6 months later.

We license it because it is the honorable thing to do.


I see he went the 12 month "Patent Pending" route hoping to sell the idea before spending 6 to 10k for a Patent smart move on his part.

METL
11-11-2011, 12:15 PM
METL, two things:

How fast can you get to your gun? It hides well but I'm thinking it might be a bit slow to get to. What's your experience?
I just realized you've gotten me stare at a picture of your crotch for a good two minutes.




:rofl: Sort of like a rickroll, but I guess a dickroll... :D


But no, those aren't my pics... they were originally posted by Wolvee.... so that's HIS sexy crotch you're checking out.. hahaha....

I don't think that type of set up will be very fast, but still, you have it with you in a place where maybe you can't normally carry...

ptwoody1
02-03-2012, 08:11 AM
Not thinking that's thats a good idea....

ptwoody1
02-03-2012, 08:12 AM
And it would probably leave a big mark..lol

TacticalWeapon
02-10-2012, 05:57 PM
I'm having very good luck with Raven Concealment's Vanguard 2

The magazine is the only thing that prints (very slightly). I even have the loop adjusted so the gun rides higher.

Intl1911
02-13-2012, 09:36 PM
Mexican carry = bad idea.

Get a proper holster and do the right thing. Too many bad things can happen.

Leader
02-13-2012, 11:25 PM
Mexican carry = bad idea.

Get a proper holster and do the right thing. Too many bad things can happen.

Carrying a gun = bad idea.......

Too many bad things can happen.

XDM 40 cal
02-18-2012, 12:30 PM
Here is mine in its holster.
http://i248.photobucket.com/albums/gg165/Aleromi99/Gun%20pics/Adamsholster2.jpg

DJ_Mid MI.
02-18-2012, 03:02 PM
remoraholesters.com I have two & have had a hard time going back to an owb holster.

BrainFearGone
02-26-2012, 06:48 PM
Shay had a provisional patent and had entered an agreement with a 'big name' holster manufacturer. That manufacturer balked, the provisional patent expired, and he approached us about 6 months later.

We license it because it is the honorable thing to do.


When will the vanguard 2 be available on the website?

METL
02-28-2012, 09:48 AM
When will the vanguard 2 be available on the website?



It is already available... you have to find it though.. it's not open to the public... there is a post on their facebook page about how to order... if you still can. The price was a little rich for my blood though... also I wasn't sure I was going to like the new anchoring system...

BrainFearGone
02-28-2012, 10:22 AM
It is already available... you have to find it though.. it's not open to the public... there is a post on their facebook page about how to order... if you still can. The price was a little rich for my blood though... also I wasn't sure I was going to like the new anchoring system...


I thought that was a pre order that already ended. I will have to double check.

Tom Fineis
02-28-2012, 10:50 AM
Pre-order ended. The price was $39.99 shipped and included some free swag. We thought it was reasonable.

It will be back up for standard retail sale shortly. Price will be $34.99 plus shipping.

BrainFearGone
02-28-2012, 11:01 AM
Pre-order ended. The price was $39.99 shipped and included some free swag. We thought it was reasonable.

It will be back up for standard retail sale shortly. Price will be $34.99 plus shipping.

Good deal. If you have a exact date you could pm me if not ill keep checking. Thank you

METL
02-28-2012, 03:44 PM
Pre-order ended. The price was $39.99 shipped and included some free swag. We thought it was reasonable.

It will be back up for standard retail sale shortly. Price will be $34.99 plus shipping.



Just for clarification, I wasn't trying to bitch about the price. :) Just didn't want to pay that price for something I wasn't totally sure was going to be the bees knees for me.

Main reason was I am considering running a tac light on my Glock... looks like there's no way to do that with the vanguard.

I may still end up with the VG2.. who knows.. can you tell me what swag I missed out on for the extra 5er? :D




Also, people should watch this vid:

vaaY3YRPbkw&lr=1

Tom Fineis
02-28-2012, 04:08 PM
Wasn't an extra $5 for the swag. Shipping is $4.90 up to about $7 to ship VG's CONUS ($4.90 typically to Michigan). The swag is a special VanGuard sticker that the pre-orders received.

We also offer a 30 day return policy if it isn't the bee's knees. ;)

METL
02-28-2012, 04:39 PM
Wasn't an extra $5 for the swag. Shipping is $4.90 up to about $7 to ship VG's CONUS ($4.90 typically to Michigan). The swag is a special VanGuard sticker that the pre-orders received.

We also offer a 30 day return policy if it isn't the bee's knees. ;)


What I meant was the $5 price difference.. I know the other price was $40 shipped... I went all the way to the last page, and lost my gumption before clicking the final click. :)

I figured that since I didn't get in on the pre order that no doubt the "free swag" was going to be a phantom holster... lol... that would be my luck.

I wasn't aware of the return policy.. maybe I'll give'r a whirl when they are released.

Thanks.