M&P 9mm Range Kit

[RockinRiley]

Yesterday I was ready to purchase 2 of these. They were going to be our christmas presents to my wife and I. (Recently got her in to shooting and she rented the m&p and loved it, so did I :)
Now where I stopped is when I learned m&p had a manual safety model. I asked if they had them and they said yes. After looking could not find one. He made a call to S&W but they were not available. It looks like I cannot get one in a range kit, (they have not yet called back, but been looking online.) I am not too concerned for myself, but I would like my wife to have the mag disconnect feature at the very least. What would you guys do? I do not want my wife in an unsafe position!

[Joeywhat]

How is an M&P without mag safety unsafe?

[TAC]

Once your wife is properly trained to understand the absence of a magazine safety, and what it means, it will no longer be an issue. It will become a desirable feature.

[Quantum007]

Training is the best answer to that question. I agree, once your wife (or even you) get some formal training you will feel very comfortable with the M&P pistols. There are several different firearms trainers on this Board, and all of them are more then capable of helping you out with this.

[RockinRiley]

Yeah, after writing I talked it over with her and she said, "I would know if the slide was not back, it may be loaded!". Maybe I am being too old school about the safety thing. I would most likely have bought if I had not found out that some models DO have a safety. So maybe I will be buying those M&P's. The shot group I had on that rental with many shots through it was just down right incredible. It was an amazing pistol and the items in the range kit were nice too!

[Joeywhat]

Also, do realize the holster included with the 'kit' is pretty subpar, and really shouldn't be used for any sort of daily carry. It'll do for 'range use' and getting to learn the firearm, but after that a better option should be pursued.

[RockinRiley]

We do not have ccw's and if I do get one, I would want a shoulder holster as I am fat and tall and do not want to expose. It would only be used for range and maybe to get started in idpa. My range has idpa every week. I am sure as I got into it, recommendations or just watching would show that I would need better. The extra mag and uplula were part of the decision and the case to hold it all was nice too. I pondered the 5" pro, but for the price just did not seem worth it at this time.

[tote'ngranny]

I have a M&P9c for my daily carry. It does NOT have any external safeties and I prefer it that way. I just started shooting, gun ownership a less than three years ago. I have relied heavily on the advice of these guys since they do know what they are talking about. Skip the holsters and such that normally come as a kit item. There are such better .. safer holsters and other equipment to be had that will serve both of you much better and keep you safer. The Upala and extra mags can be bought on sale cheap at times at Botach ( paid $19.99 per mag) and other places on the 'net.
It has been noted time an again that too many people on this forum (everywhere for that matter) will $pend for a nice gun and then scrimp on the gear .. especially the holster and that can get you hurt. IMO .. a really good holster is just as important as the quality of your gun. Just ask and these guys and they will direct you .. help you to get the instruction for doing it right .. as they have done so for me.

GET TRAINING There are some very good schools on this board who are local .. MDFI for one. I highly recomend that BOTH of you get your CPL (not CCW anymore)

Oh .. about the pro version .. we have a guy who does magic on the M&Ps and his sear is better than the pro and much cheaper .. Dougwg He is in the commercial forum area.

[forrest0872]

We do not have ccw's and if I do get one, I would want a shoulder holster as I am fat and tall and do not want to expose. It would only be used for range and maybe to get started in idpa. My range has idpa every week. I am sure as I got into it, recommendations or just watching would show that I would need better. The extra mag and uplula were part of the decision and the case to hold it all was nice too. I pondered the 5" pro, but for the price just did not seem worth it at this time.

You will find that MOST competitions including IDPA will prohibit cross-draw or sholder holsters for good reason.

[forrest0872]

You will find that MOST competitions including IDPA will prohibit cross-draw or sholder holsters for good reason.
and another +1 for get training.

forrest -

[tote'ngranny]

You will find that MOST competitions including IDPA will prohibit cross-draw or shoulder holsters for good reason.
IMO .. he is just too inexperienced to carry that way. Very dangerous.

edit .. don't mean to come across too harsh .. judgmental .. sorry if I did, but this carry style poses dangerous situations when drawing if other people are in the vicinity. I have only one friend who uses a shoulder holster, but he has been carrying, shooting for years.

[Jeep olllllo]

It sounds like this might be your first pistol(s). If so, I respectfully suggest you get a non-striker fired pistol. The fact that you think the mag disconnect will make you safer adds credence to my thoughts. IMHO a new gun owner is better off with a 10lb trigger pull between himself and a life changing mistake than a 5lb. You could always pull the hammer back when you want that lighter trigger pull on a traditional gun.

[tote'ngranny]

IMHO a new gun owner is better off with a 10lb trigger pull between himself and a life changing mistake than a 5lb. You could always pull the hammer back when you want that lighter trigger pull on a traditional gun.
On this .. I have seen that 10lb trigger pull be a disadvantage for anyone with weaker finger strength. Getting shots off with any accuracy can be difficult.

From personal experience a 5lb is more like a 10lb pull for me .. and why I sold my 1st firearm .. a S&W 638 which has a shrouded hammer and was very difficult to pull back. I had to use my middle finger to pull the darn trigger. Needless to say, I am far more accurate with a 5lb and safer. Quite a few CC'ers opt for the hammerless models anymore and what is offered more for CC.

Not trying to discourage anyone from this, but we are all different and have to go with what works best for the individual shooter.

TRAINING is the key for a new user how to be safe.

[Yance]

I would have to piggy back on the training. First and foremost be familiar with the firearm you are using especially if you plan to carry it. Trigger weight, hammerless, safeties, no safeties. If you are familiar with the platform and practice with it you will be safe regardless. Make sure to get range time with it and use it. Then when you feel comfortable enough to carry, carry around your house (unloaded at first). Practice drawing and reholstering until you are confident with the firearm and your ability, then carry everywhere you legally can when you are comfortable enough to do so.

[halka]

I got my girlfriend that exact kit. 4.25'' m&p no mag disconnect and not thumb safety. Comes with double mag holder uplula mag loader and bladetech holster.....Its a great deal for the money. This was also after she had gotten her CPL and then a month later she took MDFI defensive pistol 1. Imo carrying a pistol without proper training beyond a CPL is much less dangerous than getting a single action/double action pistol with a thumb safety and not getting the proper training.

I wouldn't recommend something SA/DA for a new shooter......while some may consider it safer......the additional tension needed to break the first shot makes it very hard to be fast and accurate out of the holster for newer shooters.

Striker fired pistols like the M&P or glock are cheap, easy to use, and reliable. Imo they are the best choice for new shooters and/or defensive purposes. Which is why that's what I got my GF, along with the training.

[tote'ngranny]

I got my girlfriend that exact kit. 4.25'' m&p no mag disconnect and not thumb safety. Comes with double mag holder uplula mag loader and bladetech holster.....Its a great deal for the money. This was also after she had gotten her CPL and then a month later she took MDFI defensive pistol 1. Imo carrying a pistol without proper training beyond a CPL is much less dangerous than getting a single action/double action pistol with a thumb safety and not getting the proper training.

I wouldn't recommend something SA/DA for a new shooter......while some may consider it safer......the additional tension needed to break the first shot makes it very hard to be fast and accurate out of the holster for newer shooters.


Striker fired pistols like the M&P or glock are cheap, easy to use, and reliable. Imo they are the best choice for new shooters and/or defensive purposes. Which is why that's what I got my GF, along with the training.
Exactly what I found out for myself ..and other women. You just said it better than I did.
Thanks!

[RockinRiley]

Sorry, did not get back to my thread, not my first pistol, prior military (that is why I wanted the safety) and we did in fact by the range kits. Great price, great guns. It is my wife's first pistol. We do not carry, these are range only.

Thanks for all the feedback,
Riley

[Dave Edwards]

Once your wife is properly trained to understand the absence of a magazine safety, and what it means, it will no longer be an issue. It will become a desirable feature.

What is a magazine safety?

[TAC]

What is a magazine safety?

Rather than type it all out, I'll just link to this:

Magazine disconnects (aka; safety)

A magazine disconnect is an internal mechanism that engages a mechanical safety such as a block or trigger disconnect when the firearm's magazine is removed. This feature was first used with the Browning Hi-Power (http://www.migunowners.org/wiki/Browning_Hi-Power) pistol. As with any firearm feature, there is debate regarding the necessity of a magazine disconnect. Historically, most magazine-capable firearm designs have had no magazine disconnect. There are exceptions, notably Ruger (http://www.migunowners.org/wiki/Sturm,_Ruger) rimfire rifles and some of their newer handgun designs, and the U.S. State of California (http://www.migunowners.org/wiki/California) passed legislation in 2006 requiring magazine disconnects on all new handgun designs sold in the state starting January 1, 2007, which has resulted in their widespread availability in other jurisdictions as well.

The arguments in favor of a magazine disconnect are that if the gun cannot fire without a magazine, then an accidental discharge can be prevented if someone removes the magazine but forgets that a round has been chambered. Also, if losing possession of the firearm is imminent, the operator can render the firearm useless by removing the magazine.
The arguments against a magazine disconnect are that without a magazine the firearm is useless except as a club. Without the feature, if a magazine was lost or otherwise not available, then at least the gun could be chambered with a single round to be used as a single shot firearm. From a technical standpoint, a magazine disconnect adds extra parts to a firearm and thus increases complexity which creates additional risk of component failure while potentially increasing production costs. In some cases, the disconnect adversely affects trigger feel, and hence affects accuracy.

Some experienced firearms operators see little value in having a magazine disconnect due to their belief that proper firearm handling and care offer equal safety. Some also see magazine disconnects being introduced as a way to appease anti-gun politicians, while lessening firearm accuracy, reliability, and safety (for always keeping a defensive weapon ready to fire, even during a tactical reload during a firefight).

[source] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Safety_(firearms)#Magazine_disconnects