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View Full Version : Cheap metal sided safes - worth the investment?



hiphi
05-28-2012, 12:39 PM
Right now we have about $1200-1500 in firearms that we would like to lock up. The main purpose is to keep anyone visiting from getting their hands on the weapons and hurting themselves. I don't think I need to spend the money for fire or theft protection at this point.

So, the question is - is it worth the money? I'm speaking here of the $150 metal safes with a cheap key lock on the front. The other option is a cheap 200 pound $400 safe, like a little Liberty safe.

I understand that neither provides a lot of protection, but I'm not spending $1000 to lock up $1500 worth of weapons. Should I just leave them in the canvas carry bags as I have them now, or get something cheap?

ka64
05-28-2012, 12:47 PM
6 in a half dozen or so, I've heard they can get in to the $5000 ones in minutes if they want to. I bought my browning more for fire than theft but I use my Cheap O Stack on for Ammo.

http://i751.photobucket.com/albums/xx155/ukrany1/Guns/100_2059.jpg

http://i751.photobucket.com/albums/xx155/ukrany1/Guns/Ammo.jpg

hiphi
05-28-2012, 12:51 PM
It would be great to have the fire suppression, although this is going to go into the basement anyway, which would be flooded in the case of a fire.

Beyond that, my house was built in 1929 and has a turn in the stairs leading down as well. I don't think a heavy safe would make it down there without causing damage.

shurhouse
05-28-2012, 12:52 PM
Just picked up a Stack-On, I think a 8-10 long gun for $99. Basically a metal cabinet with a keyed lock on the front. Same set up as you, 5-6 long guns that I want to keep out of the wrong hands. Is it going to stop a couple of B&E guys - No. Will it stop the grandkids and keep the honest people honest - Yes.

hiphi
05-28-2012, 12:58 PM
Just picked up a Stack-On, I think a 8-10 long gun for $99. Basically a metal cabinet with a keyed lock on the front. Same set up as you, 5-6 long guns that I want to keep out of the wrong hands. Is it going to stop a couple of B&E guys - No. Will it stop the grandkids and keep the honest people honest - Yes.

Exactly my idea as well. Did you find it locally? Cabela's wanted $150 for the same thing, which seemed a bit too expensive for what it is.

hopeitsfast
05-28-2012, 01:10 PM
Just picked up a Stack-On, I think a 8-10 long gun for $99. Basically a metal cabinet with a keyed lock on the front. Same set up as you, 5-6 long guns that I want to keep out of the wrong hands. Is it going to stop a couple of B&E guys - No. Will it stop the grandkids and keep the honest people honest - Yes.
This my thought as well. If someone wants to steal something badly enough they will. But at least it'll keep the kiddies out.

hiphi
05-28-2012, 01:10 PM
This my thought as well. If someone wants to steal something badly enough they will. But at least it'll keep the kiddies out.

It would also remove some of my legal liability as well, I would assume.

ka64
05-28-2012, 01:11 PM
It would be great to have the fire suppression, although this is going to go into the basement anyway, which would be flooded in the case of a fire.

Beyond that, my house was built in 1929 and has a turn in the stairs leading down as well. I don't think a heavy safe would make it down there without causing damage.

What if the fires in the basement?????????:shock:

hiphi
05-28-2012, 01:14 PM
What if the fires in the basement?????????:shock:

Well, I figure if there's a fire or a burglary, my firearms are gone. I can live with that, I guess (of course I'm saying this now, not when they are gone ....)

But, like I said, I'm not willing to spend $1000 to protect $1500 worth or weapons. The safe would at that point almost be more valuable than the contents! :-D

ka64
05-28-2012, 01:16 PM
Well, I figure if there's a fire or a burglary, my firearms are gone. I can live with that, I guess (of course I'm saying this now, not when they are gone ....)

But, like I said, I'm not willing to spend $1000 to protect $1500 worth or weapons. The safe would at that point almost be more valuable than the contents! :-D

Just yankin your chain...

hiphi
05-28-2012, 01:18 PM
Just yankin your chain...

:)

Maybe I should hang them all on the my wall with a sign, "These are not guns." Kinda like reverse psychology. ;)

fr3db3ar
05-28-2012, 01:22 PM
Well, in my house....$1500 worth of guns could be one AR with a good scope on it. Still, I only have one little safe like you're looking at and need to get another. It really only holds about 7.

hiphi
05-28-2012, 01:28 PM
Well, in my house....$1500 worth of guns could be one AR with a good scope on it. Still, I only have one little safe like you're looking at and need to get another. It really only holds about 7.

I thought the Cabela's PV12 looked nice, but I wasn't willing to plunk down $400 for it. Can't find it on their website though.

shurhouse
05-28-2012, 03:58 PM
Exactly my idea as well. Did you find it locally? Cabela's wanted $150 for the same thing, which seemed a bit too expensive for what it is.

Frank's Great Outdoors in Linwood. Ck Amazon and WallyWorld online.

partdeux
05-28-2012, 04:44 PM
KA64,

Why all the ammo in the safe?

ka64
05-28-2012, 05:04 PM
KA64,

Why all the ammo in the safe?

Tell ya in November............

partdeux
05-28-2012, 08:29 PM
Tell ya in November............
WAsn't questioning the amount of ammo, just is there a reason why it's stored in the safe?

CrimDoc
05-28-2012, 08:46 PM
IMHO ... a $300-400 "cheap" Stack On / Liberty safe with 20-30 minute fire rating is a good choice for you.

1) If you live in an area that has relatively good fire protection, the FD will likely arrive and knock down the fire before it exceeds the safe's 20-30 minute rating. On the other hand, a $150 "gun cabinet" won't protect your firearms against this threat.
2) Your typical residential burglar is a 15-18 year old kid (or two kids) who kick in a door / bust a window ... run in, smash and grab some stuff, then take off. A 300lb safe, located in the basement, will thwart this kind of burglar. They'll have neither the tools, time nor strength to get into it or carry it out.
3) If you're unlucky enough to have some "serious" burglars break into your place, you're likely going to need a high end, heavy gauge steel, safe to thwart them. They'll pry or power saw open anything in the sub $1000 range. High end safes cost a few thousand dollars ... which seems sort of a silly investment to protect a $1500 firearms collection.
4) Yes, a $150 gun cabinet will likely "keep the kids out" just as well as a $300-400 safe ... but aren't #1 and #2 worth an extra $150-250? The cost of a Marlin or Ruger .22 rifle?

steve581581
05-28-2012, 09:08 PM
The average b&e burglar won't be able to get into a gun safe. A cabinet can be broken into with the same pry bar the used to get in the house. If I were to use a gun cabinet I'd secure it to the wall and floor and ad a padlock with a reinforced hasp.

7.62 Nato
05-29-2012, 12:08 AM
The average b&e burglar won't be able to get into a gun safe. A cabinet can be broken into with the same pry bar the used to get in the house. If I were to use a gun cabinet I'd secure it to the wall and floor and ad a padlock with a reinforced hasp.
Wouldn't hurt to secure it in a closet with a strong lockable door either.

BullPup Adict
05-29-2012, 07:01 AM
Another thought...

A cheap Stack On safe out in the open with a few sacrificial 22's or BB guns might keep the local B&E thugs from finding your real stash.

just my .02
Bull

ka64
05-29-2012, 07:10 AM
WAsn't questioning the amount of ammo, just is there a reason why it's stored in the safe?

Grandchildren.........

ChaneyD
05-29-2012, 07:23 AM
Bought my Liberty for fire protection. A locked safe is for keeping honest people honest.

partdeux
05-29-2012, 11:44 AM
Grandchildren.........
that makes sense.

I had a box of .22 snap caps sitting on the kitchen counter... I'm absolutely convinced one of the kids friends picked it up. Hope they don't try putting them into a Glock, they might go off by themselves.

BigIrish
06-19-2012, 04:08 PM
IMHO ... a $300-400 "cheap" Stack On / Liberty safe with 20-30 minute fire rating is a good choice for you.

1) If you live in an area that has relatively good fire protection, the FD will likely arrive and knock down the fire before it exceeds the safe's 20-30 minute rating. On the other hand, a $150 "gun cabinet" won't protect your firearms against this threat.


An unchecked fire doubles in size every couple minutes. If an owner doesn't live in an area staffed by a full time department, you have to factor in the time it takes for a volunteer to be paged, get to the station, and respond in an apparatus.

When you consider the fact that most fires are called in by passersby when they see smoke/flames, it's easy to see how a fire can burn for 30 to 40 minutes before a department gets on scene to begin operations. depending on where the fire originated, the safe may well be toast already.

Johnnyc
06-19-2012, 04:54 PM
I bought my remington safe made by Liberty from Dunhams. I waited until the friday after thanksgiving-yes at 5 in the AM. I picked up a 1000$ safe for 450$. I have a truck so pick was no big deal. Bought burgers and beers for 2 friends to help me move it into the basement. it weighs 500lbs and it is guarenteed for 45 minutes at 1500 degrees of direct fire exposure. If it is broken into they will replace the contents or pay your deductable.

CrimDoc
06-19-2012, 06:55 PM
An unchecked fire doubles in size every couple minutes. If an owner doesn't live in an area staffed by a full time department, you have to factor in the time it takes for a volunteer to be paged, get to the station, and respond in an apparatus.

When you consider the fact that most fires are called in by passersby when they see smoke/flames, it's easy to see how a fire can burn for 30 to 40 minutes before a department gets on scene to begin operations. depending on where the fire originated, the safe may well be toast already.

Ah, but remember, the fire rating refers to the amount of time the safe should protect the contents, in a fire of a given temperature. Which means, a 30 minute rated 1500 F safe should be able to survive sitting in an actual 1500 F fire for 30 minutes. If your safe is in the basement, and a fire starts elsewhere in the home, it'll take awhile for the basement room to reach that temperature.

Of course ... there are no guarantees, and the longer the fire rating the better, but I'm guessing in urban areas, 20 - 30 minutes gives your firearms a pretty good chance.

smac61
06-19-2012, 08:55 PM
I wouldn't use the term "safe" with these, "cabinet" is more applicable.

Having said that, you can increase their usefulness by careful placement. A small closet were it can be secured to the studs and joists and positioned so that pry bars and such can't get good angles on the door. This will keep the kids safe and "keep honest men honest" as you say. Might even stop a smash and grab crack heads and neighborhood punks as well...

Real burglars are getting in either way.

steve581581
06-19-2012, 10:06 PM
I was working in a house today that has been vacant except for a few squatters here and there for a couple years. In the basement was a large gun safe that had been brutilized by pry bars and then opened up with a cutting torch. It must have taken whoever got in there a long time to get in from looking at the damage it took to get it open.

BigIrish
06-20-2012, 12:13 PM
Ah, but remember, the fire rating refers to the amount of time the safe should protect the contents, in a fire of a given temperature. Which means, a 30 minute rated 1500 F safe should be able to survive sitting in an actual 1500 F fire for 30 minutes. If your safe is in the basement, and a fire starts elsewhere in the home, it'll take awhile for the basement room to reach that temperature.

Of course ... there are no guarantees, and the longer the fire rating the better, but I'm guessing in urban areas, 20 - 30 minutes gives your firearms a pretty good chance.

yeah, I'd agree with this. personally, i think fire rating should be the chief concern among most gun owners. i know far more people who have dealt with house fires than i do who have dealt with home invasions/robberies.

The General
06-20-2012, 06:32 PM
i don't see the point in a multi hundred dollar, multi hundred pound safe unless you are either a big time collector, or have some extremely high dollar goods.

Otherwise, a gun "cabinet" positioned discretely in the home is a good choice. Put the ammo and accessories in a chest or something, you don't need a humongous safe for all that stuff.

evilcoon
07-09-2012, 07:16 PM
If I could I would convert my basement into a safe. You can never have enough space.

CrimDoc
07-09-2012, 07:42 PM
If I could I would convert my basement into a safe. You can never have enough space.

Actually ... you can ... but it's not cheap:

http://www.deansafe.com/lisavado.html?gclid=CL_krIPwjbECFWQDQAod8WnKEA

Revdrshad
07-10-2012, 02:49 AM
Remember most of the cheaper cabinets have round "Chicago" style locks on them. They are incredibly easy to open with a master key you can buy on the internet for around $50.

But that being said, it will keep kids, grandkids, and friends of such out.

But, two people can carry one out of a house and throw it in a trunk in about 3 minutes.

I like the idea of securing it in a closet where it's not able to be pried open so easily. However, I've found that if you have a basement, and that basement has Steel poles that hold your I beam up, you can secure the cabinet by putting a chain or cable through the holes in the back and locking it to the pole with the door side hitting the pole.

So chain/cable through the vent holes, push the safe with the door side up to the pole, and lock the chain around the cabinet and pole. It makes double protection for being pried open.
Not only is the door up against a pole, but there's a chain around everything and it'll just keep spinning if someone tries to pry it open.

costanza
07-10-2012, 11:54 AM
6 in a half dozen or so, I've heard they can get in to the $5000 ones in minutes if they want to. I bought my browning more for fire than theft but I use my Cheap O Stack on for Ammo.

http://i751.photobucket.com/albums/xx155/ukrany1/Guns/100_2059.jpg

http://i751.photobucket.com/albums/xx155/ukrany1/Guns/Ammo.jpg
Nice set-up! How did you reuinforce the shelves in the ammo vault? I could not see your supports for the shelves. I too have an empty, cheaper vault now, but need to store about 18,000 rounds or so, and it is HEAVY!(as you all know...duh!). It pretty much trashed the metal cabinet I used to store it in.
Regards,
Costanza

ka64
07-10-2012, 12:49 PM
Nice set-up! How did you reuinforce the shelves in the ammo vault? I could not see your supports for the shelves. I too have an empty, cheaper vault now, but need to store about 18,000 rounds or so, and it is HEAVY!(as you all know...duh!). It pretty much trashed the metal cabinet I used to store it in.
Regards,
Costanza

No nails all wood box frame style. Cabinet is lagged into the wall studds

jackg
07-10-2012, 01:37 PM
Right now we have about $1200-1500 in firearms that we would like to lock up. The main purpose is to keep anyone visiting from getting their hands on the weapons and hurting themselves. I don't think I need to spend the money for fire or theft protection at this point.

So, the question is - is it worth the money? I'm speaking here of the $150 metal safes with a cheap key lock on the front. The other option is a cheap 200 pound $400 safe, like a little Liberty safe.

I understand that neither provides a lot of protection, but I'm not spending $1000 to lock up $1500 worth of weapons. Should I just leave them in the canvas carry bags as I have them now, or get something cheap?

I can tell you that I struggled with this very same issue a few years ago and thought that if I could somehow get a 2,000 lb gun safe by the wife's vigilant eyes I'd be in heaven.
Eventually that crazy idea left and common sense began to take over...thank God.
I now have two options, the first is one of the "Stack-On" safes that has a shelf in it and will easily hold two full size 1911's plus 600 rounds of ammo.
The second option I use is my nylon Glock range bag, it's huge. I bought a lock for it & it'll holds 3-4 guns plus ammo easily.
I should say that these ideas work for me because my wife & I have been empty nesters for about 15 years now so at most I just have to keep them out of sight from the grand kids & they live out of state.
Good luck