Storing Ammo in Gun Safe

[naui1994]

I've done some research on this but I am getting mixed answers. I thought I would see what everyone on MGO thinks. I have a Liberty Fatboy Jr. with a 45 minute fire rating. I have room enough for ammo storage and would like to keep it in the safe primarily for theft protection. It is in a basement and I'm in an area where if my house caught on fire it would be a fairly quick response. I bring this up for the thought of the ammo cooking off and damaging the firearms in the safe. I'm storing approx 5k rounds. What do you do? What are your thoughts?

[Timbo]

I currently have my ammo locked in my gun safe, subscribed to this thread. Looking at getting a different locker for ammo storage.

[ezhoops]

What about reloading supplies, like powder, primers, etc. keep em in gun safe or separate

[Revdrshad]

I keep all that stuff in the safe. I think any kind of "cook off" would already be too hot for the guns to survive.
Plus it adds weight -a lot of weight- to the already heavy safe. Which would make it harder to move/transport/steal.

I also have a little sign on the safe that says: "Safe contains ammo, and explosives. Weld, cut, grind, or pry open at your own risk!"

[MetalKing]

I also have a little sign on the safe that says: "Safe contains ammo, and explosives. Weld, cut, grind, or pry open at your own risk!"

I have funny signs too. Ive seen soldiers use c4 for cooking fuel, could use the word dynamite :)

[Revdrshad]

I have funny signs too. Ive seen soldiers use c4 for cooking fuel, could use the word dynamite :)

C4 is amazing stuff...

The signs are pretty much to thwart kids or other n'er do wells from attempting a break in...

[historicfirearms]

I keep all that stuff in the safe. I think any kind of "cook off" would already be too hot for the guns to survive.
Plus it adds weight -a lot of weight- to the already heavy safe. Which would make it harder to move/transport/steal.

I also have a little sign on the safe that says: "Safe contains ammo, and explosives. Weld, cut, grind, or pry open at your own risk!"


That's a good idea, thanks.

[MSUICEMAN]

i have a rather large chunk of lead in my safe to make it so unbelievably heavy i'd be surprised if someone could budge it. my grand plan is to bolt it down, but i haven't yet.i do have some insane framing with 2x4s around it so you can't even really get a grip on it without quite a bit of carpentry.

[detacbob]

If you have a good sized fire, your safe is at the bottom of the pool. Watertight should be a concern.

[JK001]

Put the ammo in ammo cans inside the safe.

[Too Tall]

I keep my ammo and reloading supplies in a separate stack-on locking gun "cabinet". It's not quite a safe as I'm pretty sure i could break into it with a flathead and a hammer.

I was always taught to keep the firearms and ammo separate (except for carry/home defense guns).

[Revdrshad]

I keep my ammo and reloading supplies in a separate stack-on locking gun "cabinet". It's not quite a safe as I'm pretty sure i could break into it with a flathead and a hammer.

I was always taught to keep the firearms and ammo separate (except for carry/home defense guns).

I have one also. I don't use it too much. If you have a basement, you can lock it to a support pole.
You should have holes in the back. Run a chain or cable through those, then push the safe up to the pole. With the door facing the pole. then run the chain/cable all the way around and lock it.
It will never be able to have enough leverage to be pryed (Pried?) open. And if the chain/cable is good enough, nobody will be able to carry it away.

[drober30]

I too was researching different opinions on this topic as I have ordered a Liberty safe from Gander Mountain and I'm waiting for it to come in.

What I have found is just that, different opinions.

Because I live in a city where the response time will be fairly quick, my safe will be in a concrete basement so the house or floor would have to collapse for the fire to surround the safe, I have decided that I will store my ammo in my safe.

My biggest concern was moisture or mold but my safe does come with an electric dehumidifier.

I also called Liberty and asked the customer service rep what he thought and he said "that's where I store my ammo."

It's said to store your guns and ammo separately but I don't think that holds true for a professional floor safe.

[intheburbs]

Worst-case scenario - ammo in a fire-resistant safe becomes a bomb. Ammo stored on a shelf cooks off harmlessly.

[Grott]

Worst-case scenario - ammo in a fire-resistant safe becomes a bomb. Ammo stored on a shelf cooks off harmlessly.


DRAMA ? ? ? A Bomb ?

Is that you Double Barrel Joe ?

[Farmer Dan]

My Father taught to keep your guns and ammo separate and he's never steered me wrong. To many things can happen in the event someone does get in and none of them are good. I keep all ammo and reloading supplies in the garage in a locked "hazardous materials" cabinet. It's made to be explosion proof and costs less than a good safe.

[unclejoe]

If you have a good sized fire, your safe is at the bottom of the pool. Watertight should be a concern.

I agree 100%.

Personally, if I were to purchase a fireproof safe, the last place I would put it is in the basement unless it was watertight. I don't know, are the real good quality fire safes watertight too? If I had to put it in the basement I would store the ammo in waterproof containers and any guns in plastic or otherwise waterproof containers.

I was in the insurance business for 16 years and during a structure fire, thousands of gallons of water are used to put out the fire. Most of it ends up in the basement and the drains can handle that volume of water. Plus, they get plugged with debris.

Many times even a relatively small kitchen fire resulted in thousands of dollars of loss in the basement because of 'gravity, that is, water seeped and dripped from the basement ceiling and did massive damage.

[MetalKing]

I agree 100%.

Personally, if I were to purchase a fireproof safe, the last place I would put it is in the basement unless it was watertight. I don't know, are the real good quality fire safes watertight too? If I had to put it in the basement I would store the ammo in waterproof containers and any guns in plastic or otherwise waterproof containers.

I was in the insurance business for 16 years and during a structure fire, thousands of gallons of water are used to put out the fire. Most of it ends up in the basement and the drains can handle that volume of water. Plus, they get plugged with debris.

Many times even a relatively small kitchen fire resulted in thousands of dollars of loss in the basement because of 'gravity, that is, water seeped and dripped from the basement ceiling and did massive damage.

Excellent Point. Perhaps this was a sales pitch you used to sell flood and fire damage insurance right? :)

[Lakerunner]

I keep ammo in safe, when on trips was putting lap top (with battery) in also.
Got concerned that might not be good.

[cmr19xx]

I agree 100%.

Personally, if I were to purchase a fireproof safe, the last place I would put it is in the basement unless it was watertight. I don't know, are the real good quality fire safes watertight too? If I had to put it in the basement I would store the ammo in waterproof containers and any guns in plastic or otherwise waterproof containers.

I was in the insurance business for 16 years and during a structure fire, thousands of gallons of water are used to put out the fire. Most of it ends up in the basement and the drains can handle that volume of water. Plus, they get plugged with debris.

Many times even a relatively small kitchen fire resulted in thousands of dollars of loss in the basement because of 'gravity, that is, water seeped and dripped from the basement ceiling and did massive damage.

I don't disagree, but if you have a severe fire, I don't think it matters what floor you put the safe on, there is a high probability it will ultimately end up in the basement.

[unclejoe]

Excellent Point. Perhaps this was a sales pitch you used to sell flood and fire damage insurance right? :)

Naw, it was tough enough to get them to buy a basic fire and contents policy sometimes.

Speaking of 'flood', water backing-up through a sewer or drain is not a flood and in many cases is NOT covered by your homeowners insurance. Check your policy. Or better yet, get hold of an insurance claims adjuster that handles homeowner claims, you know, the guy that actually comes out to the house to assess the damage. He, not your agent, is the real expert on coverage.

With all due respect for my prior profession, an agent is basically just a salesman. His knowledge of what is covered and what is not covered is just general, especially when he is new to the business, and most of his expertise comes after he has seen what has and has not been paid for in the claims his office generated. That, plus people complaining that he TOLD them 'Yeah, that's covered!"

[Revdrshad]

Naw, it was tough enough to get them to buy a basic fire and contents policy sometimes.

Speaking of 'flood', water backing-up through a sewer or drain is not a flood and in many cases is NOT covered by your homeowners insurance. Check your policy. Or better yet, get hold of an insurance claims adjuster that handles homeowner claims, you know, the guy that actually comes out to the house to assess the damage. He, not your agent, is the real expert on coverage.

With all due respect for my prior profession, an agent is basically just a salesman. His knowledge of what is covered and what is not covered is just general, especially when he is new to the business, and most of his expertise comes after he has seen what has and has not been paid for in the claims his office generated. That, plus people complaining that he TOLD them 'Yeah, that's covered!"


I think I pay about an extra $80 annually for "Sewage back up insurance." But definitely read your policy book. I have personally been "Lied" to by my agent about what's covered, and what's not.

YMMV.

[detacbob]

My wife is my agent. I think I get accurate information....... Most of the time.

[Quads]

*edit*

[Cackler]

If you can put more than a mag or two in your safe, you either don't have enough firearms or enough ammo.

Ammo closets or lockers are the only way to go with some ammo in ammo boxes.

[Veteran]

I now store all my ammo in security cabinets, with the price and shortage of it, someone will want to steal it. The 5.7x28 that I bought for $20.00 a box at the gun show last year, now wanting $125.00 for 50 rounds it makes sense to lock it up.

[Jack-w-1911]

I keep all that stuff in the safe. I think any kind of "cook off" would already be too hot for the guns to survive.
Plus it adds weight -a lot of weight- to the already heavy safe. Which would make it harder to move/transport/steal.

I also have a little sign on the safe that says: "Safe contains ammo, and explosives. Weld, cut, grind, or pry open at your own risk!"

I also think that's a good idea. I'll be putting that to good use. Thanks.

[10x25mm]

National Fire Protection Association Code 495, which is incorporated into most municipal fire codes, requires specific design wood magazines for gunpowder and primers. It also limits you to 50 pounds maximum of gunpowder in a residence. Wood magazines delay the 'cookoff' of powder and primers in a fire, and the mandated magazine design has handles on it so it can be removed from a burning structure if at all possible. Violating NFPA 495 can result in misdemeanor charges and all kinds of civil litigation in the aftermath of a fire. Not certain whether NFPA 495 violation would compromise your insurance reibursement, but it is possible if your policy requires you to adhere to fire codes. BATFE echos NFPA 495 for commercial storage of gunpowder and primers, so dealers must be cognizant of NFPA 495.

NFPA 495 is mute on ammunition storage in residences, but wood magazines make sense for ammunition the same way they make sense for gunpowder and primers. Most foreign military specifications for indoor storage of ammunition require sealed metal cans of ammunition to be encased in wood boxes. The Soviet surplus military cartridges in spam cans, loaded in wooden crates, are a good example. The U.S. military does not allow for indoor storage of bulk ammunition, so our military packaging is sealed cans on pallets. These pallets are stored outdoors or in bunkers such as you see at Camp Perry.

If you decide to secure anything with chains, get good Grade 8 chains. The run of the mill big box hardware store plated chain is usually Grade 3 and is easily cut with bolt cutters. Grade 8 chains are hardened to the same requirements as Grade 8 bolts and can be had from specialty supply shops. I use Grade 8 chain on the gates of my business and periodically have the grim satisfaction of finding broken bolt cutter jaws when I open up in the morning.

[Fuzzbutt]

That's quite interesting info all around.

[langenc]

If you have a good sized fire, your safe is at the bottom of the pool. Watertight should be a concern.


Esp in the basement!

[Dongizmo]

I picked up a 4 drawer fire resistant file cabinet...it's 1 hour rated, lockable, and heavy....keeps all the ammo organized :freak:

[HappyVMP]

I heard it was like having a bomb in your house !

[plumbum]

If you have a good sized fire, your safe is at the bottom of the pool. Watertight should be a concern.


this is why i put mine on a home made steel pedestal. it would take an 8" flood to get into the bottom of the safe

[Draken]

Carry ammo in safe, bulk/range ammo in cabinet in basement with reloading supplies with a dehumidifier running. I just don't have room in my safe for the firearms, mags AND ammo.

[ncs]

These work well, airtight they go for $130 and free shipping if you hit the right sale.

http://www.sportsmansguide.com/net/cb/cb.aspx?a=1537715

[Subsammich]

As the fire heats up around the safe, I feel pressure would be the hazard before heat inside the safe. If its a sealed safe, pressure would rise pretty rapidly in a house fire. Im not really 100% why you would keep all that in one place anyways, split your eggs ihmo

[zr800o1le]

I was a Firefighter for 15 years and in a few house fires were Ammo was Present. One Fire I remember in Particular I was running the Pumper and Heard "Pops" going off, Later we found a 500 round Military ammo (7.62)can in the Closet that got heated good,About 15-25 rounds went off and thru the Can & Closet, after Moping up the Fire we found 2 bullet holes in the Pumper and 1 in the car parked in the Driveway. It sure was Lucky with 4 guys inside attacking the fire that No one got Hit. I've stored my Ammo in the Safe ever Since.

[Draken]

I was a Firefighter for 15 years and in a few house fires were Ammo was Present. One Fire I remember in Particular I was running the Pumper and Heard "Pops" going off, Later we found a 500 round Military ammo (7.62)can in the Closet that got heated good,About 15-25 rounds went off and thru the Can & Closet, after Moping up the Fire we found 2 bullet holes in the Pumper and 1 in the car parked in the Driveway. It sure was Lucky with 4 guys inside attacking the fire that No one got Hit. I've stored my Ammo in the Safe ever Since.

Might have been something in a loaded gun...but loose ammo won't cause that much damage;

http://youtu.be/3SlOXowwC4c

[bolonytony24]

Might have been something in a loaded gun...but loose ammo won't cause that much damage;

http://youtu.be/3SlOXowwC4c
I was thinking the same thing . should not send a projectile with much force without it chambered in a barrel to allow direct flow of pressure. I had my ammo in my safe until I ran out of room. now looking for safe for ammo only . have hefty lock box now .

[teecro]

I was a Firefighter for 15 years and in a few house fires were Ammo was Present. One Fire I remember in Particular I was running the Pumper and Heard "Pops" going off, Later we found a 500 round Military ammo (7.62)can in the Closet that got heated good,About 15-25 rounds went off and thru the Can & Closet, after Moping up the Fire we found 2 bullet holes in the Pumper and 1 in the car parked in the Driveway. It sure was Lucky with 4 guys inside attacking the fire that No one got Hit. I've stored my Ammo in the Safe ever Since.

Loose ammo cooking off could NOT cause that kind of damage...

[DEVIL DOG]

Loose ammo cooking off could NOT cause that kind of damage...
But it happened in the movie, "TRUE LIES" !!!