Barrettone
08-02-2013, 05:34 PM
Rusty
Junior Participant
Forum Member
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 11 Urgent - Please Amend or Stop HB4262
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This is bad legislation and needs immediate action against it by all Michigan Concealed Pistol Licensees. While it is being marketed as reducing knife restrictions, it does not allow a concealed pistol license holder to carry a knife designed for the purpose of self defense and has no provision for statewide preemption over local ordinances for knife carry.
It is not logical that a person trained and authorized to carry a gun cannot carry a knife for self defense.
Unfortunately HB4262 has passed the Michigan House, is heading to the Senate and was recommended by the House Judicary for immediate implementation. It is now fast tracking to pass the Michigan Senate without IMMEDIATE action by Michigan Concealed Pistol Licensees. We have a short window to have our Senators properly amend this bill to exempt CPL holders and stop self defense knife carry from being a felony offense. This is about both personal safety and principle.
For reference of current law, per the Michigan State Police Concealed Pistol Law FAQs:
5. Is it illegal to have a knife with a blade over 3 inches in my possession?
MCL 750.226 No. Michigan law specifies that a person, with intent to use the knife unlawfully against another, shall not go armed with a knife having a blade over 3 inches in length.
HB4262 is worse, as it eliminates the 3 inch provision and further codifies that knives designed for self defense are not legal for daily carry for anyone outside of law enforcement or military.
http://www.legislature.mi.gov/(S(mtc...e=2013-HB-4262
Michigan has 407,000 Concealed Pistol Licensees. We need an immediate, geometric surge of CPL holders to amend or stop HB4262. Please email and call Senator Pat Colbeck and other freedom respecting Senators urging them to submit a Senate amendment which exempts Concealed Pistol Licensees from the restrictions imposed by this bill. Then call every CPL you know and urge them to do the same. Some primary contacts:
Representative Frank Foster (Sponsor HB4262) 517-373-2629
Representative Kevin Cotter (Chairman House Judiciary Committee) 517-373-1789
Their Representative
Their Senator
Senator Pat Colbeck 517-313-7350
Thank you.
>
Subject: Urgent - Please Amend or Stop HB4262
Dear Senator _______,
As a Concealed Pistol Licensee, I am writing to express my concern with HB4262. Michigan's 407,000 CPL holders require your help to support their need to carry a knife for lawful self defense purposes. HB4262 is poorly conceived "knife reform" that provides no benefit for Michigan's CPL holders.
With HB4262, it is a felony for a law abiding citizen to daily carry any knife which may be designed for for the purpose of self defense. This is no improvement to current law and is unacceptable for a knife law reform bill.
The carry of a knife for lawful self defense should not be a felony offense for a concealed pistol licensee and other law-abiding citizens.
Representative Foster's office stated that HB4262 is intended to expand the daily carry options to the citizen, but the language indicates that this intent applies only to knives designed as common tools. Representative Fosters office confirmed my concern that HB4262 clearly restricts any knife designed for defensive purposes to law enforcement only.
Unfortunately, even for a knife carried as a tool, HB4262 still puts the burden of proof on the citizen to demonstrate their need to carry it on a daily basis.
Michigan's 407,000 CPL holders typically expect MRGO and NRA to protect their gun rights, but these organizations do not represent knife rights. Due to this void in CPL representation, HB4262 was written for the benefit of knife manufacturers and collectors without the input Michigan CPL holders who may desire to carry a knife as a back up to their pistol. CPL holders are upstanding citizens who should be allowed to carry a fixed or folding knife designed for defensive application.
Any well-trained CPL holder appreciates their imperative responsibility to retain possession of their pistol in the event of an attempted gun grab by a violent criminal. Having the option to carry a knife designed for the purpose of self defense improves their ability to break contact with a gun-grabbing criminal assailant and retain possesion of their firearm.
While I concur that Michigan's knife law can be improved, any update should at the very least clearly allow a CPL holder to carry a knife designed for the purpose of self defense with statewide preemption. Any individual authorized to carry a pistol for self defense should logically be authorized to carry a knife designed for self defense. Concealed Pistol Licensees need the same exemptions that law enforcement officers are afforded in HB4262 for the purpose of self defense.
Additionally, HB4262's language and distinction between "good" and "bad" knives is of concern in that it might be used to enact a ban on the daily carry of the common heavy-duty "tactical" folding knife you see clipped to many pockets. While we typically use "tactical" knives as general purpose tools, their design function may have features that may be useful for self defense (e.g. blade) which enable these tools be used to cause "death or injury" to another person. Please note that many common general purpose folding knives have a second, unsharpened false edge which might be banned under the "double edged" restriction of HB4262. Per Representative Foster's office, if a folding knife is designed for "military" or for self defense, it would be illegal for daily carry under HB4262.
In summary, HB4262 must be amended allow a law abiding adult to legally carry a knife designed for the lawful purpose of self defense, or it should be rejected by the Michigan House and Senate.
At a minimum, HB4262 should be immediately amended to add Concealed Pistol License holders to the list of those individuals to whom these restrictions do not apply, with statewide preemption. It is both reasonable and prudent for a trained and legally armed CPL holder to be allowed to carry a knife, designed for the purpose of self-defense, which is readily accessible to them, concealed or otherwise, to defeat an attempted gun grab by a violent criminal. Any person authorized to carry a concealed pistol should have the option of backing up that pistol with a fixed or folding blade knife designed for self defense.
At best, in the spirit of the Michigan Constitution, HB4262 should be amended to clearly allow a law abiding adult to legally carry a knife (fixed or folding) designed for the purpose of self defense if they do not intend to use it unlawfully against another person. It should not be a felony offense for an otherwise law abiding adult to carry a knife designed for self defense.
I respectfully request your leadership to properly amend HB4262 to improve the safety of Michigan CPL holders, their families and the public at large by exempting CPL holders (as with law enforcement officers) from the restrictions imposed by HB4262. Please contact your fellow Senators to enlist their support to amend or reject this bill.
Thank you,
A Concerned Michigan Concealed Pistol Licensee
Junior Participant
Forum Member
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 11 Urgent - Please Amend or Stop HB4262
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
This is bad legislation and needs immediate action against it by all Michigan Concealed Pistol Licensees. While it is being marketed as reducing knife restrictions, it does not allow a concealed pistol license holder to carry a knife designed for the purpose of self defense and has no provision for statewide preemption over local ordinances for knife carry.
It is not logical that a person trained and authorized to carry a gun cannot carry a knife for self defense.
Unfortunately HB4262 has passed the Michigan House, is heading to the Senate and was recommended by the House Judicary for immediate implementation. It is now fast tracking to pass the Michigan Senate without IMMEDIATE action by Michigan Concealed Pistol Licensees. We have a short window to have our Senators properly amend this bill to exempt CPL holders and stop self defense knife carry from being a felony offense. This is about both personal safety and principle.
For reference of current law, per the Michigan State Police Concealed Pistol Law FAQs:
5. Is it illegal to have a knife with a blade over 3 inches in my possession?
MCL 750.226 No. Michigan law specifies that a person, with intent to use the knife unlawfully against another, shall not go armed with a knife having a blade over 3 inches in length.
HB4262 is worse, as it eliminates the 3 inch provision and further codifies that knives designed for self defense are not legal for daily carry for anyone outside of law enforcement or military.
http://www.legislature.mi.gov/(S(mtc...e=2013-HB-4262
Michigan has 407,000 Concealed Pistol Licensees. We need an immediate, geometric surge of CPL holders to amend or stop HB4262. Please email and call Senator Pat Colbeck and other freedom respecting Senators urging them to submit a Senate amendment which exempts Concealed Pistol Licensees from the restrictions imposed by this bill. Then call every CPL you know and urge them to do the same. Some primary contacts:
Representative Frank Foster (Sponsor HB4262) 517-373-2629
Representative Kevin Cotter (Chairman House Judiciary Committee) 517-373-1789
Their Representative
Their Senator
Senator Pat Colbeck 517-313-7350
Thank you.
>
Subject: Urgent - Please Amend or Stop HB4262
Dear Senator _______,
As a Concealed Pistol Licensee, I am writing to express my concern with HB4262. Michigan's 407,000 CPL holders require your help to support their need to carry a knife for lawful self defense purposes. HB4262 is poorly conceived "knife reform" that provides no benefit for Michigan's CPL holders.
With HB4262, it is a felony for a law abiding citizen to daily carry any knife which may be designed for for the purpose of self defense. This is no improvement to current law and is unacceptable for a knife law reform bill.
The carry of a knife for lawful self defense should not be a felony offense for a concealed pistol licensee and other law-abiding citizens.
Representative Foster's office stated that HB4262 is intended to expand the daily carry options to the citizen, but the language indicates that this intent applies only to knives designed as common tools. Representative Fosters office confirmed my concern that HB4262 clearly restricts any knife designed for defensive purposes to law enforcement only.
Unfortunately, even for a knife carried as a tool, HB4262 still puts the burden of proof on the citizen to demonstrate their need to carry it on a daily basis.
Michigan's 407,000 CPL holders typically expect MRGO and NRA to protect their gun rights, but these organizations do not represent knife rights. Due to this void in CPL representation, HB4262 was written for the benefit of knife manufacturers and collectors without the input Michigan CPL holders who may desire to carry a knife as a back up to their pistol. CPL holders are upstanding citizens who should be allowed to carry a fixed or folding knife designed for defensive application.
Any well-trained CPL holder appreciates their imperative responsibility to retain possession of their pistol in the event of an attempted gun grab by a violent criminal. Having the option to carry a knife designed for the purpose of self defense improves their ability to break contact with a gun-grabbing criminal assailant and retain possesion of their firearm.
While I concur that Michigan's knife law can be improved, any update should at the very least clearly allow a CPL holder to carry a knife designed for the purpose of self defense with statewide preemption. Any individual authorized to carry a pistol for self defense should logically be authorized to carry a knife designed for self defense. Concealed Pistol Licensees need the same exemptions that law enforcement officers are afforded in HB4262 for the purpose of self defense.
Additionally, HB4262's language and distinction between "good" and "bad" knives is of concern in that it might be used to enact a ban on the daily carry of the common heavy-duty "tactical" folding knife you see clipped to many pockets. While we typically use "tactical" knives as general purpose tools, their design function may have features that may be useful for self defense (e.g. blade) which enable these tools be used to cause "death or injury" to another person. Please note that many common general purpose folding knives have a second, unsharpened false edge which might be banned under the "double edged" restriction of HB4262. Per Representative Foster's office, if a folding knife is designed for "military" or for self defense, it would be illegal for daily carry under HB4262.
In summary, HB4262 must be amended allow a law abiding adult to legally carry a knife designed for the lawful purpose of self defense, or it should be rejected by the Michigan House and Senate.
At a minimum, HB4262 should be immediately amended to add Concealed Pistol License holders to the list of those individuals to whom these restrictions do not apply, with statewide preemption. It is both reasonable and prudent for a trained and legally armed CPL holder to be allowed to carry a knife, designed for the purpose of self-defense, which is readily accessible to them, concealed or otherwise, to defeat an attempted gun grab by a violent criminal. Any person authorized to carry a concealed pistol should have the option of backing up that pistol with a fixed or folding blade knife designed for self defense.
At best, in the spirit of the Michigan Constitution, HB4262 should be amended to clearly allow a law abiding adult to legally carry a knife (fixed or folding) designed for the purpose of self defense if they do not intend to use it unlawfully against another person. It should not be a felony offense for an otherwise law abiding adult to carry a knife designed for self defense.
I respectfully request your leadership to properly amend HB4262 to improve the safety of Michigan CPL holders, their families and the public at large by exempting CPL holders (as with law enforcement officers) from the restrictions imposed by HB4262. Please contact your fellow Senators to enlist their support to amend or reject this bill.
Thank you,
A Concerned Michigan Concealed Pistol Licensee