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HemiChallenger
06-05-2016, 11:17 PM
I need to purchase a scope with a longer eye relief due to how its mounted on the rifle. Not quite scout scope but it needs to be longer than a normal bolt action scope (25-06 ruger #1). Eye relief has dictated my scope selection. I have (I believe) factory 1" medium ruger rings and I am not buying offset rings.

I am looking a 4 different scopes and am a little stumped...

Looking at all the specs I'm not quite sure where to go. I dont mind spending a little more money than these scopes cost, its a nice rifle. I'm not spending $1,000 on a scope though. This will be for punching paper mostly and possibly some varmit or deer hunting.

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/656314/vortex-optics-crossfire-ii-rifle-scope-2-7x-32mm-dead-hold-bdc-reticle-matte

https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1320120085/nikon-inline-xr-muzzleloader-scope-3-9x-40mm-bdc-300-reticle

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/2420112483/vortex-optics-crossfire-ii-rifle-scope-6-18x-44mm-adjustable-objective-matte

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/1648674350/sightron-sii-rifle-scope-3-9x-42mm-hunter-matte

The field of view @100 yds. throws me off. Wouldnt the smaller the # be better? I'm used to cheap/middle of the road 3-9x40 deer rifle scopes and have little to base my opinions on.
Is parralax adjustment important? I would think I'd want it but with a good piece of glass it might not really be that important?

Would the 2-7x32 work well out to say 200/300 yds with an average or slightly below average rifle shooter? I like the idea of a smaller scope on the rilfe and the price doesnt hurt either.

The nikon muzzleloader scope looks promising, but the drop indicators wouldnt work with the 25-06 obviously.

The other two are more expensive and have more features but meet my eye relief requirements.

Thanks to anyone for any input. The .22 scope thread greatly helped me.

Ol` Joe
06-06-2016, 06:44 PM
I'm not sure I understand your problem with eye relief. A #1 should take any normal scope designed for a centerfire rifle. You could possibly drill and tap the quarter rib on models that have them and mount a scout scope, but the standard Ruger rings should allow you to mount a scope over the chamber area just as it would set on a bolt action rifle. The length of the ocular lens housing may cause you to be forced to mount a scope a bit farther back toward your eye but I have never heard of anyone complaining about that.

You will want a large field of view when hunting to aide in rapid acquisition of the target. The higher the powder of the scope the narrower the FOV usually, but not always.

Parallax is important if you don't maintain a consistent cheek weld on your rifle from shot to shot. A scope of mid to low power is normally factory set to be free of it at 100 or 150 yds depending on the maker and scope. Higher power scopes say 12X or greater start to show parallax to the shooter at a greater degree, and are where most makers start adding a adjustment allowing the shooter to adjust to his desired range. Keep in mind the distance you adjust the parallax out of your scope is the only distance it is absent from without re-adjusting. Here is a read on the subject. http://rimfirebenchrest.com/articles/parallax1.html

A 2x7 will work out to the ranges you mention for deer or other big game but you will probably want more like a 3x9 at minimum if hunting smaller animals such as ground hogs or target shooting a t long range. The shooter is more of the limiting factor here then the sights. Think of those military guys in boot camp popping 500 meter target with irons.

Don't worry about mil dots etc. None are truly accurate with anything but the one load that matches their setting exactly. A scope set to work with a 150 gr bullet in a 308 won't work with a 165 or 180 gr bullet in the same cartridge. Your 25-06 with a 100gr bullet and 200yd zero should drop no more then about 6 inches out to 300 at the most. A center of mass hold should stay on targets as small as a woodchuck out to 275 or so yds and at 300 a hold on the ears of a chuck, or low on the spine of a deer should keep you in the game. That is one flat shooting cartridge farther then most hunters can utilized.

HemiChallenger
06-06-2016, 10:22 PM
I believe the 25-06 is one of the most under rated cartdriges in existance.

Thanks for your input.

The eye relief is needed due to the scope mounting on a #1. Its ahead of the action, not in the middle of it like a bolt action. Many people use offset rings and normal eye relief scopes, this is a common known issue/problem with the #1's. I'd rather use the rings that I have and buy a scope with a little more eye relief. Offset rings are $75/80 and move the front "bell" of the scope into the scope base on the rifle, thus forcing the scope further forward with a large 44/50mm objective.

Offset rings (my gun is a 1V just like this one): http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b273/308LD/R1rings002-1.jpg

Standard rings: http://www.shootingtimes.com/files/2013/09/ruger_no-1_3.jpg

westcliffe01
06-06-2016, 11:36 PM
Sightron make a better scope. In my opinion, the other 3 are el cheapo scopes that don't really belong on a $1k rifle.

How you use the rifle will dictate the features needed on a scope. If you want to shoot long, you will either need a calibrated reticle or an elevation turret that can be dialed. 9x is not a heck of a lot of magnification, but 3x is good at the wide end for hunting in thick stuff. Most modern scopes support a 4x magnification ratio so seriously consider a 3-12x42 and then of course there are 5x and 6x magnification ranges which are on higher end scopes. That would take you from 3-15 or 3-18, and those are very versatile numbers.

If I were you, look again at the Vortex Viper series of scopes in the 3-12 or 4-16 ranges and do the same for Leupold. Leupold will always be higher in price and I have been very happy with my Vortex scopes but I buy Viper and PST, not chinese made crossfire. I have several good Nikon Monarch scopes but since the Monarch 3 Nikon implemented an idiotic turret system so i will never buy another. The Nikons you have been considering are low end chinese made stuff, I would not waste my time on it. Several years ago, the 3-12x42 Monarch was over $400. Will probably be close to that today, but of course they have stiff competition for Vortex and others now.




I need to purchase a scope with a longer eye relief due to how its mounted on the rifle. Not quite scout scope but it needs to be longer than a normal bolt action scope (25-06 ruger #1). Eye relief has dictated my scope selection. I have (I believe) factory 1" medium ruger rings and I am not buying offset rings.

I am looking a 4 different scopes and am a little stumped...

Looking at all the specs I'm not quite sure where to go. I dont mind spending a little more money than these scopes cost, its a nice rifle. I'm not spending $1,000 on a scope though. This will be for punching paper mostly and possibly some varmit or deer hunting.

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/656314/vortex-optics-crossfire-ii-rifle-scope-2-7x-32mm-dead-hold-bdc-reticle-matte

https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1320120085/nikon-inline-xr-muzzleloader-scope-3-9x-40mm-bdc-300-reticle

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/2420112483/vortex-optics-crossfire-ii-rifle-scope-6-18x-44mm-adjustable-objective-matte

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/1648674350/sightron-sii-rifle-scope-3-9x-42mm-hunter-matte

The field of view @100 yds. throws me off. Wouldnt the smaller the # be better? I'm used to cheap/middle of the road 3-9x40 deer rifle scopes and have little to base my opinions on.
Is parralax adjustment important? I would think I'd want it but with a good piece of glass it might not really be that important?

Would the 2-7x32 work well out to say 200/300 yds with an average or slightly below average rifle shooter? I like the idea of a smaller scope on the rilfe and the price doesnt hurt either.

The nikon muzzleloader scope looks promising, but the drop indicators wouldnt work with the 25-06 obviously.

The other two are more expensive and have more features but meet my eye relief requirements.

Thanks to anyone for any input. The .22 scope thread greatly helped me.

HemiChallenger
06-07-2016, 12:19 AM
The higher end vortex scopes are all 30mm tubes. I understand why but it forces me to get new mounts, no option for offset.

Ol` Joe
06-07-2016, 06:34 AM
Eye relief goes down as the power increase on a variable scope in most cases. A Leupold 3-9x40 VX-2 for instance has 4.7" eye relief at 3X but only 3.7" at 9x. Just something to ponder.

solarguy
06-07-2016, 07:19 AM
I love my Vortex 4-16. I have several from Vortex. The one I use the most developed a glitch (the reticle came loose and accuracy went out the window.) They are reported to have a pretty good warranty, so I looked it up.

Sure enough, you don't even need a pre-approval or a claim number ahead of time. You just box it up and send it in. I figured it would be a month or more before I got it back. It came back in 8 days. I also sort of assumed they would just throw it in the garbage and send me a new one, but no. They repaired mine and sent it back. To me, that says they have an actual service department that knows what they are doing, and the product is designed to be serviced.

FowlWeather
06-07-2016, 07:33 AM
Good point Joe that the eye relief reduces as the magnification goes up on a variable scope.

Here are a couple other things to consider that don’t get brought up a lot. Fineness of the crosshair, and possible ring locations on the scope body. Given your need to have the scope mounted as far rearward as possible, you may need to go look at scopes or make 1 to 1 templates from the manufacturers dimensions. Just looking at eye relief can be misleading because not all of the scopes may be able to mount with the ocular lens at the same location. Your rings are fixed position, so you have to look at the distance from the ocular lens to the face of the turret mount, and also look for the objective lens contacting the scope rib like you mentioned. A short, compact scope will likely have to be mounted further forward and negate the eye relief.

I like a lot of scope magnification for target shooting, but I’ve found that the fineness of the crosshairs is more important for precision sighting than the max upper magnification. I shot a couple weeks ago with a Vortex Diamondback HP set at 16X (IMO it’s a pretty good scope for what I paid), and an old made-in-Japan Bushnell at 10X. The crosshairs in the Bushnell were noticeably finer and felt more precise even with being 6X lower magnification. Unless you will be hunting in dark timber with your gun, I’d look for fine crosshairs.

Having said all of that, I think you would be well served with a Leupold FX3 6x42 with any of the crosshairs except the heavy duplex. It has generous eye relief (4.4in), good lens coatings, and is not a compact scope. The fixed 6power may be a detriment at really close range in the north woods, but is otherwise quite adequate. I had the older model and really liked it.

shlike
06-07-2016, 04:31 PM
I believe the 25-06 is one of the most under rated cartdriges in existance.

Thanks for your input.

The eye relief is needed due to the scope mounting on a #1. Its ahead of the action, not in the middle of it like a bolt action. Many people use offset rings and normal eye relief scopes, this is a common known issue/problem with the #1's. I'd rather use the rings that I have and buy a scope with a little more eye relief. Offset rings are $75/80 and move the front "bell" of the scope into the scope base on the rifle, thus forcing the scope further forward with a large 44/50mm objective.

Offset rings (my gun is a 1V just like this one): http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b273/308LD/R1rings002-1.jpg

Standard rings: http://www.shootingtimes.com/files/2013/09/ruger_no-1_3.jpg

The rifle in the upper photo is a really sweet-looking gun!

HemiChallenger
06-07-2016, 06:14 PM
Good point Joe that the eye relief reduces as the magnification goes up on a variable scope. x3!

Here are a couple other things to consider that don’t get brought up a lot. Fineness of the crosshair, and possible ring locations on the scope body. Given your need to have the scope mounted as far rearward as possible, you may need to go look at scopes or make 1 to 1 templates from the manufacturers dimensions. Just looking at eye relief can be misleading because not all of the scopes may be able to mount with the ocular lens at the same location. Your rings are fixed position, so you have to look at the distance from the ocular lens to the face of the turret mount, and also look for the objective lens contacting the scope rib like you mentioned. A short, compact scope will likely have to be mounted further forward and negate the eye relief.

I like a lot of scope magnification for target shooting, but I’ve found that the fineness of the crosshairs is more important for precision sighting than the max upper magnification. I shot a couple weeks ago with a Vortex Diamondback HP set at 16X (IMO it’s a pretty good scope for what I paid), and an old made-in-Japan Bushnell at 10X. The crosshairs in the Bushnell were noticeably finer and felt more precise even with being 6X lower magnification. Unless you will be hunting in dark timber with your gun, I’d look for fine crosshairs.

Having said all of that, I think you would be well served with a Leupold FX3 6x42 with any of the crosshairs except the heavy duplex. It has generous eye relief (4.4in), good lens coatings, and is not a compact scope. The fixed 6power may be a detriment at really close range in the north woods, but is otherwise quite adequate. I had the older model and really liked it.

Thank you for your input. I like the tempelate idea. I completely agree on the finess of the crosshair.

I also realize I wont be able to have 100% of everything I need or want in a scope so I may have to make some exceptions. I'm going to go to a few places with large scope selections and really narrow down my search.
With the 25-06 being so versatile having a scope that has the eye relief with the versatility becomes tricky. If I go to offset rings, I will be limited to a 1" tube. If I buy new scope mounts I should go to 30mm but then I cant get offset mounts!

solarguy
06-07-2016, 07:04 PM
The Vortex 4-16 has a 1" tube.

And the 4x zoom range works good looking for squirrels up close, or out at 400 yrds.

HemiChallenger
06-07-2016, 07:34 PM
The Vortex 4-16 has a 1" tube.

And the 4x zoom range works good looking for squirrels up close, or out at 400 yrds.

Your 4x zoom range comment just dawned on me. 3x9 and 4x12 6x18 are all 3x zoom range. I agree a 4-16 is what I should get.

Ol` Joe
06-07-2016, 07:39 PM
You might look at Burris scopes along with Leopold's. Burris has the turret a bit farther forward then other brands which often lets you move the scope back further in the rings. Leopold however often has the most eye relief which will probably make up for the positioning.

HemiChallenger
06-07-2016, 07:48 PM
I was under the impression burris was a cheaper scope. Upon investigation they are not! Thanks.

Leupolds are all over the place price wise.

HemiChallenger
07-13-2016, 11:36 PM
Following recommendations form you guys I purchased this: http://www.midwayusa.com/product/2420112483/vortex-optics-crossfire-ii-rifle-scope-6-18x-44mm-adjustable-objective-matte

The dead hold BDC actually has finer crosshairs than the v-plex reticle. I couldnt justify a more expensive scope not knowing how much this gun will get shot or used.

I really wanted a 4x16 but the 50mm objective put me dangerously close to the rifle barrel and limited mounting fore and aft for eye relief. Worst case scenario if I dont like the 6-18 I have another varmit rifle that it will work well on and the cheapo 4-16 I have on that can go on the #1 or on the shelf.

Thanks for you input everyone.

HemiChallenger
09-25-2016, 10:15 PM
Finally shot my #1 with this scope last weekend. I think a 4-12x44 wouldve been a better choice. However the 6-18 is pretty clear. It was left at 6-10 zoom most of the time. 14-18 zoom range and you have to adjust parallax to really see clearly.