Reviews of Walther PPQ vs. H&K VP9?

[burninglegs]

I'm looking at the PPQ and the VP9. I haven't come across a review here that compares the two. Any members own both that could help give their thoughts?

[Draken]

Had both, sold the VP9.

The VP9 was slightly faster on followup shots for me, but the PPQ was more precise on followup shots and the VP9 trigger is not as nice as the trigger on the PPQ (imo)
Slow fire, much more accurate with the PPQ over the VP9.
There are many more holster choices for the VP9.

It's going to depend on you. Not everyone shoots the same, but the PPQ is my preference of the 2, and would like to get my hands on a longslide PPQ.

[DrScaryGuy]

I'll second pretty much everything Draken said. I bought a p99as, liked it, bought a ppq, liked that too. bought a VP9, traded it for a PPQm2. I'm fully a walther junkie now, with a p22 and even their g22 carbine in the family.
If you really want the little removable ears to help you rack a slide, get the VP9. The grip is more customizeable on the VP9 too, but the standard PPQ grip fits my hand pretty well, so it's not an issue.
I also like the trigger on the PPQ better, but I didn't fire the VP9 anywhere near enough to see if it got better with break-in. I remember shooting better with the PPQ also, but like I said, i didn't use the VP9 enough to be sure. That being said, the PPQ trigger reset is so short and light, i saw somebody accidentally "bump fire" it.
Either one will probably make you pretty happy, but the VP9 has compatability with the P30, so you might be better off that way.

[Mkc451]

I'm looking at the PPQ and the VP9. I haven't come across a review here that compares the two. Any members own both that could help give their thoughts?

Another Walther snob here. Will try not to ramble. I sold my M&P9, and my M&P9 CORE(Which replaced a Glock 19) after I got a Walther PPQ 5". Thinking real seriously at getting a PPQ 45 also, but I do love my 1911's so it's not a priority.

As far as accuracy, from a bench rest w/my hand loads, I can hold a sub 1.5" groups @ 25yds, @ 10yds it's a cloverleaf. Offhand groups sub 2-2.5" from 5-10yds slow fire are not a problem. Rapid fire, they expand some but I can hold 3-4" inches normally. Factory loads (S&B 124gr, Sp&Lw 124gr) shoot almost as good.

Trigger is phenomenal, to the point you best be familiar with it, it can surprise you. The break after take up is very light & precise (the proverbial glass rod). Reset is short so follow ups are fast. I did the hand load in particular to get a soft shooting load, to enhance the long barrel for even less barrel flip. I started looking at the PPQ after my wife test shot a PPQ M1 when she was looking at pistols. She went with a SR9 (cost was the major factor). I fell in love with the ergonomics and trigger on the PPQ. Actually I think I liked the paddle release better but the M2's have standard push button mag releases. In fact the only issue I know of on the PPQ M2 is some folks think the mag release is too light and it will sometimes easily depress and drop the mag. I may or may not have run into that. I did have 1 unintended mag release during my very first steel challenge meet, but I don't know if that was the mag release button or the very nervous first time competitor that was me. Never happened before or since. But I did decide to replace the mag button release spring with a stronger one, about doubled the release pressure required.

I also now own the PPQ in 22lr also (same 5" barrel), feel is the same, so it makes for cheaper practice. I shoot Steel Challenge with the 9 mm PPQ. Gonna try IDPA this year with it. By far any weakness in competition is me, not the pistol. I sold my other carry pistol (XDS 9mm) and replaced it with a PPS. As I said I am turning into a Walther snob.

Biggest issue with the Walther is finding a holster and accessories. I ended up with a CrossBreed Microtuck for my PPS and a Comp-Tac international for my PPQ, it's open bottom so it fits the longer 5" barrel. I also just got a Multi-Holster for the PPQ, but haven't tried it yet as it took almost 12 weeks to get it.

As for sights -- Dawson makes an adjustable rear sight & a front sight for the PPQ, but I am considering a Hi-Viz front sight, the white dot can be tough on my old eyes and a Hi-Viz S&W SW99 will fit, plus it's cheap.

I have not shot all the pistols available in 9mm, never the H&K but compared to Glock 19, SR9, M&P9 & M&P9 CORE, I will take the PPQ over any of them.

[Snowy.vtwin]

Nice.
My pkk/s may be looking for company. I'm not much of a shooter but I was impressed with the trigger on mine. I got it a couple months ago and weather hasn't been very much fun for shooting yet this year.

[burninglegs]

Thank you for the reviews guys. I am coming from the background of owning (still own) several 9mm Glocks. I appreciate and enjoy them for what they are, but want something else to add to the quiver. I have owned or shot several 9mm S&W M&Ps, Taurus, Rugers handguns. None of them really interested me enough to want to go out and buy one. However seeing a VP9 in person at the local dealer and hearing nothing but great things about the PPQ makes me want to get one.

Glock 19 is my favorite 9mm that I have shot and/or owned. Based on the size, weight and capacity. Standard trigger is lacking. Ergonomics aren't the greatest, but it has been nothing but reliable for me. Just want something similar in size; 4" barrel, <25 oz, +15 rounds that I would be able to conceal carry if I wanted. From what I have seen online, the PPQ seems closer to the G19 and the VP9 seems closer to the G17 in terms of how they carry, so that might be one of the factors that will help me decide.

But ultimately I want a great shooter, especially in regards to the trigger (both VP9 and PPQ will be a big upgrade over my Glocks), something that I will want to take to the range all the time and enjoy shooting. From those that have replied, it seems the PPQ is the better gun in just about every way than the VP9 except for things like market support.

Anyone care to mention how close or how large the gap is between the two? Is it a night and day different in favor of the PPQ, or more just subtle differences? I assume I would be happy with either one at the end of the day.

[Mkc451]

Can't compare to a VP9 ... but the trigger on the PPQ is as much better than my M&P CORE Performance Center as the Performance Center was better than a stock M&P9 ... Best bet is to see both at a LGS and compare them side by side. If you were on this side of the state I would be glad to meet you somewhere and let you shoot my PPQ. But you are on the wrong side of the state. Maybe you could find a local range where you can rent both. That is the best way.

[burninglegs]

Thanks for the offer Mkc. I'll have to see if there is a range that offers the ability to rent both of them. Not sure if there is one by me, but I will look.

[Draken]

Anyone care to mention how close or how large the gap is between the two? Is it a night and day different in favor of the PPQ, or more just subtle differences? I assume I would be happy with either one at the end of the day.

It's not night and day difference, both are damn nice firearms, but most of the people I know that have shot both prefer the PPQ. You are starting to see more and more stuff for the Walther lineup because they are really gaining in popularity.

Full disclosure, my 3gun/USPSA pistol is a CZ P-09, and my EDC is a S&W M&P .357sig. My wife has ran the PPQ in 3gun and USPSA, and is her EDC and it is the only full size doublestack she likes. She shot the VP9, she shot the CZ, the M&P, several Glocks...just to name a few.

[BuddyChryst]

I typed out a short novel here, so feel free to skip down to the TLDR section for the head-head comparison.

I've always been an all-metal, DA/SA SIG guy. I kept hearing people rave about the PPQ trigger and then a guy at the LGS had me dry fire one. It was real nice. The PPQ went on my "want list" but had several firearms ahead of it. A couple years later, I still didn't have a plastic fantastic (well, not completely true...I had picked up a SP2022 at that point), and the VP9 and P320 are released. Being a SIG guy, the P320 had my attention until I saw it was the P250 frame. My buddy had one and I wasn't impressed with the ergos. Everything I saw about the VP9 intrigued me, and my old beat-up P7 is a tack driver. It looked like the thing had no muzzle rise; I have big hands and the 3-panel sizing called out to me. But that damned Euro mag release kept me from buying until a LGS had one to play with. The VP9 felt like it was made for my hand. Just felt right. Wasn't any trouble with my big hands to get the mag release paddle with my thumb either. So I set my max price in my head and got one shortly after.

After stripping, cleaning and lubing, I took it to the range. Started with my normal pace and peppered all around the black at 10 yards. WTF? Pushed it back a bit and slowed down and sure enough it was a tack driver. Brought it back in and sped up again and couldn't keep it centered. Kept stringing high right. I could even feel the pistol "wiggling" or yawing. Weird. Just gotta get used to it I guess.

But I had a bigger issue…why did my finger hurt? No, not trigger slap. With my big hands and experience with DA pulls on the SIGs, I use a lot of finger on the trigger. When the trigger would break on the VP9, the tip of my finger would get poked by the paddle mag release sticking up. That was annoying. Contacted HK and the CS guy was great. Sent me new paddles and some springs. Unfortunately, it was only marginally better. But I had a spare now so I did what I never to and bubba’d. Filed down the paddle and it’s much better now. Plus I have the original to swap back.

Out of nowhere, someone here on MGO pops up with a helluva deal on a PPQ M2. As excited as I was for the VP9, I wasn't as much about the PPQ. It’d been out for years and I had my price set in my head and never found one at the right price. This time, it just felt it was too good of a deal to pass on for a pistol that was on my list. After cleaning the damned Frog Lube off the guy had on it, I took both to the range. The VP9 feels better in the hand, but the PPQ isn't far behind. Can’t say I’ve checked the spec sheets, but the PPQ feels a touch lighter and shorter than the VP9. Comparing them to my SIGs, the VP9 is more SP2022 sized where the PPQ is more P229. Fired off a couple mags worth and WOW. Just fun to shoot. Perfectly predicable muzzle rise and fall. No wiggle, so slippage. Sped it up and sure the group opened up, but it didn’t string. I was grinning. I liked this gun.

Then it happened. Well, started happening. Failures. First it was the slide jammed up just out of battery with a live round. Had to take it home to free it up it was so tight. Well, I had decided to load up some reloads (from what used to be a trusted source). The round was hourglass shaped, visibly out of whack. OK, ammo problem, not the pistol. So I purchased a case of Fiocchi and went back out. Shot a mag or two and let a buddy try it. He had 2 consecutive stovepipes. Of course, I’m thinking he’s limp-wristing. So I take a shot and it sounded more pop than bang. Drop the mag and clear out an empty case. Check the barrel…no squib. Again, ammo problem, not the pistol. Fiocchi replaced the case for me. Once I got the new ammo, I ran several hundred rounds through it to reassure myself it was good to go (along with checking proper function with SD rounds), and started carrying it instead of my P229.

One thing I don’t like about the PPQ is the sights. They do the job, but I wanted night sights. So I got the Mepro 18801s and went to the outdoor range to do a before/after (to see any vertical change in POI) and change the sights. Chilly day, probably around 40-42 degrees and windy. Got unpacked and set up targets. Loaded up a mag and went to do the “before” group. CLICK. Wait for a hangfire…chamber check…yup it’s loaded. Well, that should’ve been enough to reset the striker. CLICK. Wait again for hangfire, drop the mag and clear it. Hmm…light primer strike, maybe hit another bad set of Fiocchi? Maybe a hard primer? Put the round in my pocket and reloaded. CLICK. 5 rounds in a row. Went back to the table and put those 5 rounds in the VP9. Fired all 5 no problem. Not ammo this time. Broke down the PPQ and pulled the striker assembly to see if something broke. Why is there lube on the striker??? I doubt the factory lubes the striker, especially how specific Walther is about where to lube and how much. I know I didn’t put anything in there. Must’ve been the first owner, but it didn’t smell like minty Frog Lube. Wiped it all down and the channel too. Put it back together and it works again! 40 degrees was cold enough to thicken whatever it was enough to induce failure. Did a thorough cleaning at home and launched a plastic cleaning rod tip to the ceiling on function test. Still, my confidence in the pistol has been shaken a bit. I wonder if body heat would’ve kept it warm enough to function properly, but I’ll be putting another couple hundred rounds through it before I carry it again.

TLDR:

VP9 – feels perfect in my hand. Even with the large panels all around, I wish I had a little more real estate for my support hand, but it works. The trigger is nice, but not awesome. Almost no take up, decent break, and a decent reset. Mag release paddles work, but isn’t as intuitive (for me) as a button. I do use my thumb, on the left side paddle, not my index or middle finger on the right. I did have to reshape the paddles (!!!) to keep them from poking my trigger finger when the shot breaks. I have the LE version, so it came with actual night sights (and 3 mags), not the glow sites. The pistol is easy to shoot very accurately during slow fire, but it tends to string up and right for me with rapid fire. If I death grip it, it stays on target better, but I’m not naturally a death grip shooter.

PPQ – I have the M2 and much prefer the large button release. Haven’t had any accidental mag drops that some claim. I use the large backstrap and again wish the grip was slightly larger. I put Talon rubberized grips on and love them (I use Hogue overmolded on my SIGs). The stock sights work, but I like the Mepro better. Very easy to change the sights; no pusher needed, but you do need a small hex socket, small allen wrenches and a small screwdriver. I got a slight rise in POI, but nothing that bothered me. The trigger is simply fantastic. There is more take up than the VP9, but the break is so clean. The reset is also excellent – very short and positive. Where the VP9 trigger follows your finger to reset, the PPQ gently pushes your finger to it. The Walther does seem to have a touch more felt recoil than the VP9 (smaller and lighter), but I’m used to shooting .40 (my PPQ is 9mm). The muzzle rise and fall is very predictable.
I was excited to buy the VP9 and felt “meh” after I shot it, where I was “meh” about buying the PPQ and excited after I shot it. I keep bringing the VP9 to the range, hoping I’ll fall in love, but it hasn’t happened. They are both perfectly accurate shooters. Slow fire my groups are tighter with the VP9, but rapid fire the PPQ wins without a doubt. I’m still deciding if I want to keep the VP9 (I probably will, I don’t sell often). If I could go back and only buy one, it’d be the PPQ. As I’m not sure I will keep the VP9, I haven’t holstered it. I did get an Alien Gear Cloak Tuck 3 for the PPQ. It works, but I definitely should’ve spent the extra bucks to get an MTAC. Mags aren’t cheap for either pistol. Ultimately, after changing sights on the PPQ and adding a mag, I’m roughly $50 cheaper than the LE VP9.

As the P320 came out at the same time as the VP9, it’s worth mentioning that I did rent one and it shot great. I still don’t love the feel of the grips and hope that an aftermarket develops for the grip modules. I do like that the SIG offers the full sized and carry sized with 17 round mags. I do have a price that I’d buy at in my head, but I haven’t seen one at that price yet.

What good is a review without pics? Oddly, I don’t have them side to side.

VP9 with it's older brother P7:


VP9 against P229:


PPQ against P229: