458 Socom AR or 45-70 Govt Lever

[FowlWeather]

You can use the 450 bushy for black powder season ? Please confirm this. Thanks.

I noticed this too. I had never heard this before, and the Michigan Hunting Guide confirms that it would not be legal: "Muzzleloading Deer Seasons: An individual hunting deer with a muzzleloading firearm during the muzzleloading deer season shall only possess or carry afield, or take a deer with a crossbow, muzzleloading rifle, muzzleloading shotgun, or black-powder pistol, loaded with black-powder or a commercially manufactured black-powder substitute."

Maybe the poster is from a neighboring state?

[postban]

You can use the 450 bushy for black powder season ? Please confirm this. Thanks.

Only if it is a muzzleloading 450 Bushmaster.

not sure if serious

[dirtmcgirt76239]

Only if it is a muzzleloading 450 Bushmaster.

not sure if serious

I was seriously asking, I had never heard that suggested before.

[dirtmcgirt76239]

I noticed this too. I had never heard this before, and the Michigan Hunting Guide confirms that it would not be legal: "Muzzleloading Deer Seasons: An individual hunting deer with a muzzleloading firearm during the muzzleloading deer season shall only possess or carry afield, or take a deer with a crossbow, muzzleloading rifle, muzzleloading shotgun, or black-powder pistol, loaded with black-powder or a commercially manufactured black-powder substitute."

Maybe the poster is from a neighboring state?

Ok, thanks, I have only hunted muzzle season with a borrowed muzzie and a bow a few times. I am not super up on every little detail, and I had never heard anything suggesting 450 or straight wall rds etc were also legal.

[Quack Addict]

Why won't it work, how does the 45 raptor you mentioned headspace? It will headspace on the case mouth like the 30 carbine, 45 acp... or even the 45 rsptor. The big advantage of the rimless 444 is it is the same size as a 308 (width and length) so it will work without any mag adapter, and have the same number of cartridges in the mag as the 308. To change calibers, just swap barrels. Best part is it is slightly tapered (like most rifle rounds), so it ejects easier than pure straightwall non tapered cartridges like the 45 raptor. The idea came up when a rifle was not 100% reliable with the 45 raptor.

444 Marlin uses a roll crimp. You want a taper crimp for a cartridge that headspaces on the case mouth.

You could probably cobble together or have a custom taper crimp die made. I have one for a 44 Mag, and the 444 is basically a long 44 Mag.

[shifty_85]

Have you thought of the other big bore AR upper? .50beowulf just looked the uppers for a basic flat top are a little over 700 at the moment and a complete rifle is 1,100 and some change. Also ammo for the .50 Beowulf has come down quite a bit for factory 25 bucks for 20 is a lot better than when I was looking into them.

Also you can use Dessert eagle bullets for reloading as well.

Not sure how easy to come by .458 bullets are.

As for the 45-70 its been around for ever tons of load data and you can cast your own bullets as well. A lever gun is one of the few I don't have and it would be 100% a 45-70.

Not sure if cost was a factor or not but last time I looked .50 beo was cheaper than .458 stuff.

Just throwing another option in the ring

http://www.shopalexanderarms.com/50_...mmunition.html

http://www.shopalexanderarms.com/Rif...ete_Rifle.html

https://youtu.be/0CrUARlmqso

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[Ol` Joe]

Have you thought of the other big bore AR upper? .50beowulf just looked the uppers for a basic flat top are a little over 700 at the moment and a complete rifle is 1,100 and some change. Also ammo for the .50 Beowulf has come down quite a bit for factory 25 bucks for 20 is a lot better than when I was looking into them.

Also you can use Dessert eagle bullets for reloading as well.

Not sure how easy to come by .458 bullets are.

As for the 45-70 its been around for ever tons of load data and you can cast your own bullets as well. A lever gun is one of the few I don't have and it would be 100% a 45-70.

Not sure if cost was a factor or not but last time I looked .50 beo was cheaper than .458 stuff.

Also .50 Beowulf is straight wall case so you can use it in the shotgun zone!!

Just throwing another option in the ring

http://www.shopalexanderarms.com/50_...mmunition.html

http://www.shopalexanderarms.com/Rif...ete_Rifle.html

https://youtu.be/0CrUARlmqso

Sent from my LG-TP260 using Tapatalk

No, no, no
Shotgun zone cartridges are limited to 45cal and a case length of 1.80" or less.

[shifty_85]

No, no, no
Shotgun zone cartridges are limited to 45cal and a case length of 1.80" or less.

Ah dang. Could have swore it was one of the few good to go in shotgun zone. Thanks for setting me straight.

Also I re read OP post he said he doesn't hunt so ill probably just delete that part.

I know your big into reloading ol Joe. Are .50AE bullets easier/ cheaper to buy than .458 socom?

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[shifty_85]

Page 18/19 Michigan Hunting and Trapping Digest

• A .35 caliber or larger rifle loaded with straight-walled cartridges with a minimum case length of 1.16 inches and a maximum case length of 1.80 inches.
• A .35 caliber or larger air rifle or pistol charged only from an external high-compression power source, or a muzzle-loading rifle.

http://www.michigan.gov/documents/dn...t_461177_7.pdf

The .50 Beowulf is straight walled .35 cal Or larger. Case length of 1.65

That meets all the requirements doesn't it?

Not trying to start anything just trying to make sure I'm not misreading it.

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[hartofthethumb]

Page 20 Michigan Hunting and Trapping Digest

• A .35 caliber or larger rifle loaded with straight-walled cartridges with a minimum case length of 1.16 inches and a maximum case length of 1.80 inches.
• A .35 caliber or larger air rifle or pistol charged only from an external high-compression power source, or a muzzle-loading rifle.

http://www.michigan.gov/documents/dn...t_461177_7.pdf

The .50 Beowulf is straight walled .35 cal Or larger. Case length of 1.65

That meets all the requirements doesn't it?

Not trying to start anything just trying to make sure I'm not misreading it.

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FWIW, I never read or heard of any limit of .45caliber. I was interested in the .450 Bushmaster long before the DNR made that change for the initial '3 year trial period', and I don't recall anything at any time of such a limit.

Not to say I couldn't have missed it, but I would say I am over 99% sure...