Gun Shows that ban guns (split off from another thread)

[somecrazygreek]

Consider the irony of a business making money promoting a legal product, banning customers from having that same legal product at the venue where they are selling that product.

It’s as if wearing clothing were banned at a fashion show...[emoji15]


MHB

Google "gun show accidental shooting", and you'll see why they ban loaded firearms. There are SO many results. People are idiots.

It's a business choice. People getting shot on your property during a show is bad for business, and your insurance rates. Hell, I remember a few years ago 5 people were shot at 3 different gun shows across the US within a few hours of each other. I don't blame them for banning loaded carry, it covers their ass if someone decides to bypass security with a loaded weapon and accidentally shoot someone.

That being said, I've NEVER been to a gun show that had metal detectors or pat downs, and I've seen MANY people with clear firearm bulges say "No sir no firearms" when walking through security.

A huge % of gun owners are totally responsible, & would pose absolutely no problems carrying loaded firearms in GFZ. The very small # that would pose a problem are the ones these promoters are using for their decision. No different from different laws & restrictions. I don't personally know anyone that should be barred from carrying a gun in the Post Office. And still, there is a law that keeps everyone from carrying there.

The problem isn't carrying in a GFZ, it's taking out your firearm at a gun show to show someone like an idiot and letting a round off that hits someone else who's just trying to shop.

[Barney556180]

The problem isn't carrying in a GFZ, it's taking out your firearm at a gun show to show someone like an idiot and letting a round off that hits someone else who's just trying to shop.

Well there’s no real cure for stupid.


MHB

[Barney556180]

Google "gun show accidental shooting", and you'll see why they ban loaded firearms. There are SO many results. People are idiots.

It's a business choice. People getting shot on your property during a show is bad for business, and your insurance rates. Hell, I remember a few years ago 5 people were shot at 3 different gun shows across the US within a few hours of each other. I don't blame them for banning loaded carry, it covers their ass if someone decides to bypass security with a loaded weapon and accidentally shoot someone.

That being said, I've NEVER been to a gun show that had metal detectors or pat downs, and I've seen MANY people with clear firearm bulges say "No sir no firearms" when walking through security.

The problem isn't carrying in a GFZ, it's taking out your firearm at a gun show to show someone like an idiot and letting a round off that hits someone else who's just trying to shop.

Good points made. Now to think through the issue again.



MHB

[DeSchaine]

Google "gun show accidental shooting", and you'll see why they ban loaded firearms. There are SO many results. People are idiots.

Very true, people are idiots and there are a lot of HIGHLY PUBLICIZED incidents. I emphasize that because those stories serve the anti purpose/narrative so well. Just like mass shootings, the media latches onto those and uses them to further the agenda. What you don't see are the stories of police accidents, because those don't fit the agenda. But there are A LOT of those as well. I'm willing to bet that the rate is higher, per capita, for cops than it is for civilians. We just don't hear about it. As an example, the NYPD, between the years of 2004 and 2014 had 195 "unintentional discharges" from among its 35k+ officers. A tiny percentage, sure, but that's still almost 20 a year for ten years.

And yet, on the Sports Shows website:

ATTENTION:
When bringing firearms into a Gun & Knife Show Please follow these simple steps.

1. Bring the firearm in with no ammunition in the weapon.
2. Notify security if you have any ammunition. They will check in all ammunition as you enter.
3. Have firearm inspected and safety strapped so that it may not operate inside the show.
4. Be sure to stop back and retrieve ammunition on your way out of the show. All straps on firearms may be removed at that time.

The only exception to this rule is if you are a police officer with badge and I.D. Or an officer on duty in uniform.

Supporting and promoting the ownership and usage of firearm by denying the carrying of it except to a protected class that is arguably less safe than the average civilian with their firearms? Hmmmm.

[SteveS]

Google "gun show accidental shooting", and you'll see why they ban loaded firearms. There are SO many results. People are idiots.

It's a business choice. People getting shot on your property during a show is bad for business, and your insurance rates. Hell, I remember a few years ago 5 people were shot at 3 different gun shows across the US within a few hours of each other. I don't blame them for banning loaded carry, it covers their ass if someone decides to bypass security with a loaded weapon and accidentally shoot someone.

I am sorry but there is just so much wrong with this post.

If I were on FB or some other site, I'd guess that this was the drivel of some anti-gunner because you use the exact same "logic" as people use when they want to set up GFZs. You remind me of an associate of mine that used to send me articles about people doing stupid things with guns. There isn't an epidemic of gun show accidents. The reality is that gun accidents are rare (and have been declining for decades), but get a ton of media attention (surprise) and people mistakenly assume that it is a major problem and that guns need to be banned. See where I am going with this?

Another reality is that gun accidents can happen anywhere. If the problem is like you suggest, the result of people taking out their carry gun at a show and letting a round off, deal with those idiots. Other gun shows, gun stores, and similar venues manage to survive without banning guns.

Stop repeating this nonsense about insurance or liability. There has never been any proof offered that this is the reason.

[SteveS]

Maybe instead of just staying home we should actually go to the show and protest.

Stand outside with signs and try to convince people to not go in.

That is a possibility. How about a letter from several Michigan gun rights groups that expresses concern for this policy and politely asks them to re-consider the ban on lawful carry?

[costanza]

I am sorry but there is just so much wrong with this post.

If I were on FB or some other site, I'd guess that this was the drivel of some anti-gunner because you use the exact same "logic" as people use when they want to set up GFZs. You remind me of an associate of mine that used to send me articles about people doing stupid things with guns. There isn't an epidemic of gun show accidents. The reality is that gun accidents are rare (and have been declining for decades), but get a ton of media attention (surprise) and people mistakenly assume that it is a major problem and that guns need to be banned. See where I am going with this?

Another reality is that gun accidents can happen anywhere. If the problem is like you suggest, the result of people taking out their carry gun at a show and letting a round off, deal with those idiots. Other gun shows, gun stores, and similar venues manage to survive without banning guns.Stop repeating this nonsense about insurance or liability. There has never been any proof offered that this is the reason.

Hey Steve:
I, for one, do not mind disarming for a short time to enter a gun show. I don't find it to be that big of a short term infringement of my rights. I do not like disarming, however, at other locations at all. Some do not feel the same, and that is fine. No one is forcing anyone to go to a gun show. I cannot imagine, however, that the ban on carrying at shows is for any other reason than to prevent accidental discharges. It is not a 'nonsense' argument at all. Liability is probably the reason for the restriction. Perhaps the insurance companies have a sinister, anti-gun plan, but I have no proof of this, and very few do. Just as there is no proof that this is part of a bigger plan to disarm us everywhere. I don't like disarming at gun shows, but I really don't see it as part of a bigger movement to ban guns as some do. If I have to disarm for an hour or two to do something gun-related I really like doing, I'm ok with it. I'd rather disarm and show my support for the shows than stay home. Without supporting the gun shows and shops, we as pro-gun people would have fewer and fewer places to enjoy our hobby. We all may have different opinions here on MGO, but we are all supposed to be on the same side of the gun debate.

As a side note, I've been at a large gun show where there was an accidental discharge. It became dead silent, with the crowd focusing on the area where the shot was fired. And who was there at the center of it? My uncle, that I went to the show with. The guy next to him fired off a round into the display table. It was a very eerie, uncomfortable feeling, and could have been lethal. There are a number of idiots out there who do not have the capacity to safely drive, handle guns, etc. I would agree that the act of disarming at the show entrance is an inherently dangerous operation, and should be done in one's vehicle rather than in the doorway. I think disarming (at gun shows only) is a safety and liability issue, if you do not agree, that is fine. I'm sure my comments will upset some, and that's fine. We are all entitled to our opinions.

Regards,
Costanza

[dougwg]

When entering gun shows....

Smart people answer the question "Are you bringing in any guns today?" with "No! Guns are scary!" and then just walk right in.

And we don't touch the damn thing when we're there.

[SteveS]

Hey Steve:
I, for one, do not mind disarming for a short time to enter a gun show. I don't find it to be that big of a short term infringement of my rights. I do not like disarming, however, at other locations at all....We are all entitled to our opinions.

We are all entitled to our own opinions, but we are not entitled to our own facts. The fact is that gun accidents are at an all-time low and this includes gun shows. This is amazing when you consider how many people own and carry guns. There will always be some stupid people, but I don't believe the only answer has to be to entirely ban us from carrying and let LE and exempt (which has already been demonstrated to be more dangerous) carry. One of the things we have always had on our side is reason and logic. Gun control doesn't increase safety and is based on feelings and emotions. This is the justification behind GFZs.

I am not for one second saying that they are doing this for some nefarious reason. I have no idea why they are, but the fact that many gun shows DON'T do this tells me that it isn't liability or insurance companies.

Why are you ok with disarming there, but not at other GFZs? This doesn't make much sense. We are all supposed to be on the same side, but let's be honest, there isn't universal agreement. There are plenty of gun owners that are supportive of some level of infringement on our rights. Clearly, some here are ok with this one. Do you really believe that this will help? Are you one of those people that think a GFZ is safe because of a sign?

[SteveS]

When entering gun shows....

Smart people answer the question "Are you bringing in any guns today?" with "No! Guns are scary!" and then just walk right in.

And we don't touch the damn thing when we're there.

I can certainly see the wisdom in this, but it sad that even gun owners are so conditioned as to believe that a GFZ is a reasonable thing to ask for.