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  1. #51
    Legal Forum Contributor / Super Moderator SteveS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by northman View Post
    I believe this gun sanctuary county movement is a great preemptive move. We know our governor and AG are in favor of “Red Flag” gun laws and worst. The reason they are laying back is that Michigan can be a swing state in the upcoming election. Trump barely carried it in 2016 and the Democrats are playing it safe not trying to stir up the conservative side especially the gun owners. You can bet if Bernie or one of the others are elected our state will push for measures like what Virginia is doing. They are on the defense let’s be on the offense. Let’s push our agenda and see how the democrats react. Hopefully we can bait them into doing something stupid that will stir up all gun owners and conservatives for the up coming election. This also gives us gun owners a good chance to organize for anything else down the road our lawmakers throw at us. Why sit passively by when we can be pro active in this matter. Get involved, organize!
    Why do they need to wait for Bernie. Trump has come out several times in support of Red Flag laws. Red Flag laws have been implemented in states that are hardly liberal (Indiana and Florida). Regardless, this isn't something that will come from the feds.
    Opinions and comments made by me on this forum should not be considered legal advice.

  2. #52
    I can't post links yet! Forum User
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    Did I say it would come from the Feds? I said our governor and AG. Did you even read my posting? Or is it a knee jerk reaction.?

  3. #53
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    Nobody is "laying back." There is a state rep, Wittenberg, who introduces a "red flag" law every year. It's there. There is also a bill introduced by my state senator, Bayer, that changes the existing state law regarding handguns (registration, UBC, etc.) so that it applies to ALL firearms. The ONLY reason those bills haven't gone anywhere yet is because the Repubs are in the majority. You can bet that if the Dems get control, we would get that and more.

  4. #54
    Legal Forum Contributor / Super Moderator SteveS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by northman View Post
    Did I say it would come from the Feds? I said our governor and AG. Did you even read my posting? Or is it a knee jerk reaction.?
    Yes, you made it seem like if Bernie won, that the left would push the red flag issue. I said that red flag issue has been pushed by the left AND the right. Did you read what I wrote?

    Regardless, most of what I have seen from the Sanctuary movement hasn't made me all that hopeful.
    Opinions and comments made by me on this forum should not be considered legal advice.

  5. #55
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    This is only a half thought through comment, so be gentle if you pummel it.

    I think pre-emptively creating a sanctuary city shows weakness and is a bad idea.

    Illegal alien sanctuary cities were created to hide/protect an action that is illegal. The reverse of what is being done with 2nd amendment sanctuaries.


    Creating a 2nd amendment sanctuary seems like a few things to me:
    1. It feels like making the statement that we give up and have come to terms with the eventuality of the State impacting our rights. Not the message rolling around in my mind.
    2. Why should I have to take sanctuary from the State harming my rights? Seems like hiding from the bully so he doesn't take your lunch money, when instead you should be learning how to make a shank. Kidding....kinda
    3. Backing up to our county or city and declaring it is a sanctuary seems like giving up the State to those we are looking to fight. And a sanctuary from the people who are supposed to work for us? Seems like it just sends the message that 'we get it, you're the boss, but we're going to give you mean looks'.

    If red flag laws or other further line-crossing events happen, go ahead and enact the sanctuary. Let them know we disagree with the infringement and won't recognize it. But doing it before hand seems like waving a white flag.

    I shall go back to my adult beverage and let the regularly scheduled programming resume.

  6. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by Einthewoods View Post
    This is only a half thought through comment, so be gentle if you pummel it.
    I'd sure like to hear your total thoughts if this work was just half thought out.
    Nicely said.
    "But then there are plenty of gun folks who think no one should rock the boat because it might piss off the anti gun crowd/politicians and cause even more gun control." - Bikenut
    Submissive gun rights advocates need to lose their submissiveness before we lose our 2A rights.

  7. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by Einthewoods View Post


    Creating a 2nd amendment sanctuary seems like a few things to me:
    1. It feels like making the statement that we give up and have come to terms with the eventuality of the State impacting our rights. Not the message rolling around in my mind.
    2. Why should I have to take sanctuary from the State harming my rights? Seems like hiding from the bully so he doesn't take your lunch money, when instead you should be learning how to make a shank. Kidding....kinda
    3. Backing up to our county or city and declaring it is a sanctuary seems like giving up the State to those we are looking to fight. And a sanctuary from the people who are supposed to work for us? Seems like it just sends the message that 'we get it, you're the boss, but we're going to give you mean looks'.
    Uh...no I don't see it that way. I see it as "We know what you're planning to do. After all you haven't been trying to hide it. But even if you're successful at passing unconstitutional gun laws, rather than fighting it for years in the courts, we're simply exhibiting mass non-compliance, and with the blessings of our Sheriffs."

    I'm hoping it may lead gun-control debates to the eventual answer "Why bother? Do we really want to create a whole new class of criminal?"

  8. #58
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    Iosco county officially added, full support.

  9. #59
    Legal Forum Contributor / Super Moderator SteveS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stevie-Ray View Post
    Uh...no I don't see it that way. I see it as "We know what you're planning to do. After all you haven't been trying to hide it. But even if you're successful at passing unconstitutional gun laws, rather than fighting it for years in the courts, we're simply exhibiting mass non-compliance, and with the blessings of our Sheriffs."

    I'm hoping it may lead gun-control debates to the eventual answer "Why bother? Do we really want to create a whole new class of criminal?"
    I guess it depends on what is being promised. In most instances, they are either promising something that is vague or something that they really can't do.
    Opinions and comments made by me on this forum should not be considered legal advice.

  10. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by SteveS View Post
    I guess it depends on what is being promised. In most instances, they are either promising something that is vague or something that they really can't do.
    This is where I struggle with the 2A sanctuary thing. I get the impression that there is little cohesiveness in what's being requested, no guidance except we have to do this. I'd liked to see this better organized so when it is presented to the County's there is continuity throughout the state, at least that way it makes it sound like on voice.

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