What brace and muzzle device do you have on your AR pistol to keep it under the 26in oal?

[Scoop]

At what point does my Federal-recognized pistol become an SBR?

The 'R' in SBR means rifle, which means a weapon designed or redesigned, made or remade, and intended to be fired from the shoulder. Unless the BATFE changes it's mind yet again and reverses it's 2019 ruling, braces and blades are not designed to be shouldered (even though they CAN be) and your pistol doesn't magically become a rifle based on how you hold it.

ATF Rulings:

ATF RULING IN 2014
In 2014 when all the AR pistol jargon started to upset politicians, the ATF decided that even when firing from the shoulder, an AR pistol does not classify as an SBR. Ruling that that weapons are classified on their physical design characteristics and not usage/functionality.

ATF RULING IN 2015
After previously ruling that shouldering an AR pistol was perfectly fine without a Form 1; the ATF tried to calm the tempers of the anti-2nd Amendment politicians, and made it illegal to shoulder an AR pistol. Claiming that once shouldered the AR pistol became an SBR; anyone without a Form 1 and paid tax stamp could be indicted on serious federal charges for shouldering a pistol brace.

ATF FINAL RULING IN 2019
The ruling in 2015 thankfully didn’t stand long as the idea of re-classifying a weapon system based on how you hold it didn’t quite seem reasonable (much like the majority of other firearm restrictions…but I digress), and in 2019 the fine citizens of the U S of A were given a “final ruling” by the ATF. The ruling reads as follows:

“To the extent the January 2015 Open Letter implied or has been construed to hold that incidental, sporadic, or situational ‘use’ of an arm-brace (in its original approved configuration) equipped firearm from a firing position at or near the shoulder was sufficient to constitute a ‘redesign,’ such interpretations are incorrect and not consistent with ATF’s interpretation of the statute or the manner in which it has historically been enforced.”

Side note: Don't put a VFG on an AR pistol, though. Then you're venturing into 'Other firearm' or AOW territory (federally). See GreaseMonkeySRT's last post with the link to the chart.

[Fuel Fire Desire]

I use a Maxim PDW brace. It uses a shorter buffer tube with a proprietary buffer (1/2 length). OAL with the brace fully extended to the end of the (long) linear compensator is 26.5”. With the correct measurement method from end of buffer to end of naked barrel it’s only 19” IIRC. I like the Maxim quite a bit, it’s very well made, but expensive. SB makes an economy version that uses a traditional buffer and tube length with a few less locking positions and slightly lower build quality for about $120 less. Troy makes one of their own that uses a bufferless system with a proprietary BCG (the buffer is a part of the BCG) that is as short as you can possibly go, but it’s astronomically expensive.



7.5” barrel with a 2.5” long flash can on this one. I built it as a novelty, but I’ve been thoroughly impressed with it in function, accuracy, comfort, and mobility. The linear compensator significantly tames the blast from that 7.5”. Standing next to it it’s no more unpleasant than a 16” with a muzzle brake. It cycles everything too. I feed it a steady diet of steel case and have not had a single malfunction with it. Upper assembly and BCG is PSA factory except for the SL hand guard.




This is the Troy. I’m not sure if it’s also sold in brace form or not.

[JDG]

At what point does my Federal-recognized pistol become an SBR? This is one of those finer (confusing?) points in the law that I don't fully understand. I plan for my build to be a Michigan-legal pistol, but with all the nuances and subtleties included within the laws, I just want to make sure.

When you put a stock on it, which requires a tax stamp.

[shookme]

Any barrel over 10.5" you'll be over. Federally it will still be a pistol if it has a brace, but will be a "firearm" in Michigan. Long gun transport laws will apply.

Just to be clear, does a "firearm" (over 26" OAL with a pistol brace) require anything more as far a paperwork? I guess what I'm asking is I'm not worried about carrying an AR pistol but I just want to build one with a SB Tactical brace and have a barrel length somewhere between 10.5" to 12.5". Would that configuration require an RI -060?

[CyborgHunter]

Just to be clear, does a "firearm" (over 26" OAL with a pistol brace) require anything more as far a paperwork? I guess what I'm asking is I'm not worried about carrying an AR pistol but I just want to build one with a SB Tactical brace and have a barrel length somewhere between 10.5" to 12.5". Would that configuration require an RI -060?

With a 10.5" bbl and a SB Tac Brace, it will most likely come in under 26" OAL. Mine did.
In that case you have a Pistol according to Michigan.
If you put it together yourself, no RI-060 is required, since that is a record of sale--not build.

Be careful to only use a virgin lower or one that was originally on a pistol.

[Matt`G]

Side note: Don't put a VFG on an AR pistol, though. Then you're venturing into 'Other firearm' or AOW territory (federally). See GreaseMonkeySRT's last post with the link to the chart.

Good call out on the VFG's. I can't find much on angled foregrips, any idea on the legality of these on an AR pistol? At a minimum I want to put a hand stop on my foregrip to help with consistency of grip (and to keep from getting too close to that muzzle!), just hard to find detail on what's legit.

[shookme]

With a 10.5" bbl and a SB Tac Brace, it will most likely come in under 26" OAL. Mine did.
In that case you have a Pistol according to Michigan.
If you put it together yourself, no RI-060 is required, since that is a record of sale--not build.

Be careful to only use a virgin lower or one that was originally on a pistol.

Thank you. This build would be on a never used stripped lower. Why is that important if this wouldn't be registered as a pistol? Just a cover your ass deal? I'm not trying to be facetious either, just making sure I wade through this swamp of legality correctly. Thanks again.

[Roundballer]

Thank you. This build would be on a never used stripped lower. Why is that important if this wouldn't be registered as a pistol? Just a cover your ass deal? I'm not trying to be facetious either, just making sure I wade through this swamp of legality correctly. Thanks again.

This is a Federal law. IF it was originally built as a rifle (the OEM would have that recorded) and it is modified by shortening the barrel or the OAL to below 16"/26" respectively. It is a Short Barreled Rifle and an NFA item by definition.

If the lower came from the factory only partially complete or stripped, it is "Other", and you can build anything you want.

If it came from the factory assembled as a pistol, you can convert it to a rifle and back again without repercussion, (SCOTUS Thompson vs. US)
As long as you never assemble an NFA item from the collection of parts

[erict]

Good call out on the VFG's. I can't find much on angled foregrips, any idea on the legality of these on an AR pistol? At a minimum I want to put a hand stop on my foregrip to help with consistency of grip (and to keep from getting too close to that muzzle!), just hard to find detail on what's legit.

I went with the Magpul XTM Hand Stop. Works good for quick forward hand placement.