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Firearms Legal Protection

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  1. #1
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    They are coming for the Pistol Braces - Q Honeybadger no more

    https://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/at...-desist-letter

    "Dear Customer: On August 3rd, 2020, the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (“ATF”) issued Q® a formal Cease & Desist letter, notifying us that ATF has taken the position that the Q Honey Badger Pistol is a short-barreled rifle (“SBR”) regulated under the National Firearms Act (“NFA”). In response, Q has ceased all production of the Honey Badger Pistol, and submitted a comprehensive letter to ATF and the Department of Justice (“DOJ”) stating why we disagree with this classification[1]. Additionally, we have provided recommendations on how to address the firearms already in circulation. Q is seeking solutions that best protect you, the individual, and Q’s distribution network from falling out of compliance with ATF regulations, and federal law. At this time, Q has not received any definitive guidance from the ATF.
    In the meantime, Q encourages possessors of the Honey Badger Pistol to take these proactive measures until a resolution is reached between Q and ATF.
    1. Complete one of the following:
    A: Remove the barreled upper receiver from the lower receiver and dedicate it as a replacement
    for another AR-style pistol or registered short-barreled rifle; or
    B: If you do not possess another AR-style pistol or registered short-barreled rifle, remove the barreled upper receiver from the lower receiver and temporarily transfer it out of your possession by, for example, transferring it to the dominion and control of another individual; and
    2. Once the previous step is completed, you may file an ATF Form 1 to register the lower receiver as a short-barreled rifle. Upon Form 1 approval, the firearm may be reassembled.
    Failure to complete option a or option b could result in prosecution and is subject to a $10,000.00 fine and up to 10 years imprisonment."

    ================================================== ==========================================

    https://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/br...d-desist-order

    "The Bureau of Alcohol Tobacco and Firearms has issued a 60-day stay of their cease and desist order against Q, LLC regarding production of the Honey Badger pistol with SB Tactical stabilizing brace."
    "A more cynical view would be the ATF has chosen to punt the decision until after the election to see which way the political winds are blowing when the 60 days are up in December."
    Last edited by Samurai Jack; 10-15-2020 at 08:12 AM. Reason: update

  2. #2
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    Doesn't sound like they're coming for all pistol braces. The pistol brace on the Q Honey Badger is proprietary, and IIRC can't even be used as a brace. The part the strap is attached to is rigid and doesn't fit design features of a brace to the degree where someone's arm can actually fit in it.

    Regardless it's BS and the NFA needs to be repealed.

  3. #3
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    And it doesn't appear to be as much about the BRACE itself as it is about the DESCRIPTION of the firearm on Q's web site.

    From the C&D to Q from the ATF: "Based on the product description on your website, ATF believes these firearms are designed and intended to be fired from the shoulder and may be classified as a short-barreled rifle under the GCA and NFA."

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Scoop View Post
    And it doesn't appear to be as much about the BRACE itself as it is about the DESCRIPTION of the firearm on Q's web site.

    From the C&D to Q from the ATF: "Based on the product description on your website, ATF believes these firearms are designed and intended to be fired from the shoulder and may be classified as a short-barreled rifle under the GCA and NFA."
    I'd be curious as to what "product description" would lead one to believe it is intended to be fired from the shoulder.

    However, the cease and desist letter from the ATF also singles out Q's Sugar Weasel which is just using the standard SBA3 brace.
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    Ragnarok Arms, LLC in Saline, MI- Type 1 FFL
    www.ragnarokarms.com

  5. #5
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    Use link form GOA to send Trump a letter.........

    https://gunowners.org/na10072020/?ut...sident%20Trump

  6. #6
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    It seems like the atf are measuring the length of pull on a diagonal. Q put out a picture of a measurement of 13.335" when measured at a straight line as should be.

    https://m.facebook.com/UNPOSSIBLEbyQ...pe=3&source=48

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by wizzi01 View Post
    It seems like the atf are measuring the length of pull on a diagonal. Q put out a picture of a measurement of 13.335" when measured at a straight line as should be.

    https://m.facebook.com/UNPOSSIBLEbyQ...pe=3&source=48
    I didn't think length of pull has anything to do with SBR/pistol. I thought it's OAL and a rifle butt stock or brace, which is seems to be the brace in question here.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by december1979 View Post
    I didn't think length of pull has anything to do with SBR/pistol. I thought it's OAL and a rifle butt stock or brace, which is seems to be the brace in question here.
    The atf considers 13.5" or more length of pull a stock.

  9. #9
    MGO Member Fuel Fire Desire's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wizzi01 View Post
    The atf considers 13.5" or more length of pull a stock.
    Unofficially officially.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by wizzi01 View Post
    The atf considers 13.5" or more length of pull a stock.
    I did not know this, I though you could put any ATF approved brace/blade on an AR15 with a barrel less than 16" and it would be a "pistol" or AR pistol not an SBR. So If you run a shockwave 2.0 blade (13 - 3/16" pull) with a Law Folding adapter (adds 1.3") it would make it an illegal SBR (not sure if can fire while folded). I would assume that all ATF approved braces/blades would be under the 13.5" but it would seem you could have configurations that might put the length of pull over 13.5" while using these approved braces/blades.

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