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Firearms Legal Protection

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  1. #1
    I am a Forum User
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    Cap and ball rules

    Since ammunition and reloading components no longer exist and the shortage appears likely to last for at least the next 2 years if not longer (that’s how long the backorders alone are for at the distributer level from what I hear) I have taken alternative measures to continue shooting. Since I cannot get primers and refuse to pay a piece of crap scalper a single penny, let alone 5 to 10 times the price, I must now reload primers, a tedious and dangerous task. I must cast my own bullets and I must rely on any brass I recover or can salvage from the range, I can still get gun powder but I am not sure for how much longer. Loaded ammunition is in the pen with my pet unicorn, right next to the Loch Ness Monster and is being guarded by Big Foot and a Lepricon (I.E. it now exists only in the realm of myth and legend). Any modern ammunition I have remaining is now in reserve in case of emergency, I no longer go to the range as to not waste irreplaceable ammo.

    Unfortunately though brass can only be reloaded so many times and likewise there is a limit to how many times I can reload a primer. I also cannot make smokeless powder.

    This has gotten me interested in cap and ball revolvers. Cap and ball revolvers do not require a shell casing and I can make new percussion caps from empty pop cans (or I will once I finally receive the tool I ordered, however it seems to be on an indefinite backorder and the supplier does not communicate so I do not anticipate receiving it for months, I may have it by summer, maybe), and I can also make my own black powder and cast my own projectiles so theoretically I can keep shooting. Making percussion caps is still tedious and dangerous but at least I can make them new, I also wont have to mess with an anvil or having to clean them to be reused.

    Unfortunately though percussion caps are just as impossible to find as primers so until my tool arrives even my cap and ball revolvers will be paperweights. I actually considered a flint lock for this reason. I really do think the ammunition issue is at that point now. But while I am waiting for my cap maker to arrive I have questions relating to Michigan law:

    My understanding is that cap and ball revolvers do not require registration, is that correct?

    If it came down to it would the carry laws for a cap and ball revolver be the same as a modern handgun in terms of Open Carry? I don’t see why they wouldn’t be, but still thought it prudent to ask.

    Could I carry a cap and ball revolver under my CPL if need be?

    If I installed a drop in conversion cylinder (assuming I somehow found conventional ammunition or reloading components) which does not require modifying the revolver would any of the above change?

    What about a conversion cylinder which does require modification?

    What if I switched back to the cap and ball cylinder?

    Fun fact, I was in Dunhams a few days ago and the ONLY ammunition they had was .416 Rigby at over $220 for 20 rounds, and some .475 Winchester. That was it. Didn’t know there was much African big game hunting in Michigan.

  2. #2
    MGO Member
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    I am a loss for words but I too thought about carrying my flint lock revolver,I have two pounds of salt peter/ potassium nitrate that I salvaged from my collected urine,I make my charcoal from my trees ,I bought 20lbs flowers of sulfer from the Chem shop,I can stuff rocks,nails,broke glass in my blunder.buss,watch your eyebrows making caps

  3. #3
    MGO Member Coctailer's Avatar
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    I started getting interested in cap and ball. Bob's Gun And Tackle in Hastings still has caps on the shelf.
    I have a conversion cylinder for my 1860 snub nose also.

    Just discovered the cap maker last week and thought about ordering one. I'll be curious to see how you like it.
    I think carrying a cap and ball would be fine for a BBQ gun, but I would be afraid to carry it for realz. Those caps slip off really easy even when you cram them on there.

    I dont know the legal answers, but I bet there will be a Karen that posts below screetching about registration. LOL

    Start a thread documenting your journey. I think it sounds interesting!
    Last edited by Coctailer; 02-23-2021 at 06:04 AM.

  4. #4
    I am a Forum User
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    Black powder guns are NOT firearms so no registration or restrictions at all. Now if you add a conversion cylinder and use smokeless ammo then you are on different ground.

  5. #5
    I am a Forum User
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coctailer View Post
    I started getting interested in cap and ball. Bob's Gun And Tackle in Hastings still has caps on the shelf.
    I have a conversion cylinder for my 1860 snub nose also.

    Just discovered the cap maker last week and thought about ordering one. I'll be curious to see how you like it.
    I think carrying a cap and ball would be fine for a BBQ gun, but I would be afraid to carry it for realz. Those caps slip off really easy even when you cram them on there.

    I dont know the legal answers, but I bet there will be a Karen that posts below screetching about registration. LOL

    Start a thread documenting your journey. I think it sounds interesting!
    Oh I don’t intend to carry it unless I have to. For right now I still have ammo for my normal modern carry guns, I’m thinking long term ammopocolypse though, think about it, we already have the current shortage, we have communists running the government that would happily ban ammonif they could or make it even worse attempting to get, and on top of that we probably have another summer of rioting ahead and possibly a war coming, ammo resupply is a real concern. As is I have no range ammo and cannot get any, right now this is mostly about getting me back to the range, but long term it’s about ensuring that I at least have SOMETHING.

    Watch those belly guns, they are simple to carry, about like a modern revolver, but black powder really requires a full barrel to give you decent ballistics, I went with the 8 inch for that reason, should I ever actually have to carry it I should be able to squeeze out roughly 9mm performance, at the cost of concealability, if you want it more concealable you could look at the 5.5s, they should get you around .380 ACP performance. The belly guns not so much, they have been used successfully historically (especially with the Mormons) but you’d really be limiting yourself. Also in a pinch the 8 inch could take game.

    What I would like to see is a cap and ball made to take full smokeless pressures, but I don’t think anyone makes one. The conversion cylinders CAN, but the frames cannot. I’m imagining a cap and ball that can swap cylinders like an RG (but with actual quality, unlike an RG), take 209 primers (though I’d like to see a number 11 percussion cap version as well), and use .357 magnum and .44 magnum load data, and jacketed bullets. You would basically have a cap and ball revolver that functioned like a 6-8 round magazine with modern ammo. Even an updated Ruger Old Army would work. Specifically to get around gun bans and the 1968 GCA, but also for issues like this.

    I agree with the Barbecue gun thing though, the cap and balls would be fantastic for that, especially the engraved models, they really are pretty guns. I’m partial to the 1858 Remingtons looks myself, plus it can hot swap cylinders which makes it one of the best choices anyway. Uberti or Cimeron for looks, Pietta for use (cheaper and can accept conical cartridges, I’d go with the target model though which kills the cheaper part but is very nice with a crowned barrel, progressive rifling, and adjustable target sights)

  6. #6
    MGO Member Moleman-'s Avatar
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    The rws/dynamit nobel made caps are much hotter than the cva, remington or cci cap, but the remington caps stay on my pistols better. Be interesting to see what happens with them since remington is no longer.

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