red dot for defense?

[Leader]

For home defense, even at night when I don't have time to grab my glasses, I like my lasers.
If I can't get the gun to where iron sights can be used, I still know where the bullet is going.

[Bikenut]

Seems to me that using the gun's sights (iron, red dot, scope even) is a distance/time relative thing. If I can smell his breath as he is trying to harm me point and shoot would be all there is time for and I will even shoot from the hip if necessary. Can't see sights then. Getting shots on target from the hip while moving back/sideways transitioning into more distance allows front sight press and more distance allows time for sight alignment can be an interesting practice session.

Where or when would a red dot become an advantage? I don't know but when I experimented with a red dot I spent too much time/concentration looking for that dot instead of focusing on the target itself. And the same thing happened when I tried lasers.

[wsr]

Seems to me that using the gun's sights (iron, red dot, scope even) is a distance/time relative thing. If I can smell his breath as he is trying to harm me point and shoot would be all there is time for and I will even shoot from the hip if necessary. Can't see sights then. Getting shots on target from the hip while moving back/sideways transitioning into more distance allows front sight press and more distance allows time for sight alignment can be an interesting practice session.

Where or when would a red dot become an advantage? I don't know but when I experimented with a red dot I spent too much time/concentration looking for that dot instead of focusing on the target itself. And the same thing happened when I tried lasers.

Then your presentation/index needs work, that’s the beauty of red dots and lasers you use target focus if your index is correct the dot will be there

[Bikenut]

Then your presentation/index needs work, that’s the beauty of red dots and lasers you use target focus if your index is correct the dot will be there

If my presentation/index is correct why would I need the red dot/laser? Wouldn't the iron sights also be there?

[wsr]

If my presentation/index is correct why would I need the red dot/laser?

For the same reason you need iron sights ….precision

[Bikenut]

For the same reason you need iron sights ….precision

Again I ask...

If my presentation/index is correct why would I need the red dot/laser? Wouldn't the iron sights also be there?

I'm not being a jerk. I'm actually quite curious as to the merit of red dots and even lasers over point shooting/iron sights. Especially since I jumped on the new thing about red dots and lasers a while back but after experimenting I couldn't see (no pun intended) any great benefit for defensive use. And perhaps it is just me but I found hesitating until finding the little dot, red dot or laser, a detriment whereas the iron sights were right there. Didn't need to look for them.

[wsr]

Again I ask...

I'm not being a jerk. I'm actually quite curious as to the merit of red dots and even lasers over point shooting/iron sights. Especially since I jumped on the new thing about red dots and lasers a while back but after experimenting I couldn't see (no pun intended) any great benefit for defensive use. And perhaps it is just me but I found hesitating until finding the little dot, red dot or laser, a detriment whereas the iron sights were right there. Didn't need to look for them.

Not being a jerk either, if your presentation is just decent The dot will be within several inches of where you’re looking on the target (definitely on a persons torso) so all you have to do is fine tune there should be no need to look for the dot….if you are looking for the dot then it’s not on the persons torso so your presentation/index is bad

[Leader]

Again I ask...

I'm not being a jerk. I'm actually quite curious as to the merit of red dots and even lasers over point shooting/iron sights. Especially since I jumped on the new thing about red dots and lasers a while back but after experimenting I couldn't see (no pun intended) any great benefit for defensive use. And perhaps it is just me but I found hesitating until finding the little dot, red dot or laser, a detriment whereas the iron sights were right there. Didn't need to look for them.

If you're point shooting, you aren't using the sights anyway.
How do you see the iron sights in the dark?
Without glasses?

[Bikenut]

Not being a jerk either, if your presentation is just decent The dot will be within several inches of where you’re looking on the target (definitely on a persons torso) so all you have to do is fine tune there should be no need to look for the dot….if you are looking for the dot then it’s not on the persons torso so your presentation/index is bad

Understand and appreciate it.

What I'm saying is if my presentation/index isn't on then I'm looking for the dot instead of the target just as I would be looking for the sights. At least the front sight. But if my presentation/index is on and the red dot is on target then so are my iron sights.... hence why would a red dot be an advantage over the iron sights? And if I'm looking at the dot instead of what the bad guy is doing then I'm in trouble whether my presentation/index is on or not.

I personally didn't think finding the red dot or the laser dot was any easier than finding the front sight. But I did find myself hesitating just a micro second checking for the affirmation of the dot instead of firing even with everything already lined up. I considered losing that little bit of time a negative. A negative bigger than the red dot/laser units adding to the bulk to be carried and the possibility to an electronic failure. Added all together I decided I wasn't gaining anything. Quite the opposite actually.

And that is why I, in all seriousness, asked what the benefit of a red dot/laser would be.

[Bikenut]

If you're point shooting, you aren't using the sights anyway.
How do you see the iron sights in the dark?
Without glasses?

Up close point shooting is useful and effective but makes red dots/lasers/iron sights moot. Otherwise night sights. Glow in the dark iron sights. But if it is so dark I have to rely on a red dot wouldn't there be a human tendency to put entirely too much focus on the dot, the brightest thing, and not the guy again resulting in a bit of hesitation/focus off the guy?

Again guys, not trying to be a jerk but really just don't see any advantage to red dots. Hell, if you guys can convince me I'll give both the red dot and a laser another try. ... Although with a laser a person could be in a physical position (behind a couch reaching over the top maybe?) where they couldn't be behind the gun but could still get the laser on the bad guys COM.