Help With info about an old shotgun

[J Carter]

Hi all,

I just inherited an old Iver Johnson single barrel 20 gauge shotgun. It is in rough shape, currently cannot fire due to all the grime in the firing pin area. I'm planning on stripping all the rust off, sanding it down and re-bluing the entire piece. I will also replace all the wood furniture. Once this is done, I plan to do some hunting with it. That's where I need help because I don't know if this gun can take 2 3/4" shells or if it needs 2 1/2". If anyone could help out with knowledge of when 2 3/" shells were introduced or with any Iver Johnson specific info, I would much appreciate it.

On the receiver it says the following:

"Iver Johnson Arms & Cycle works
Fitchburg, Mass U.S.A.
Champion"

The serial number has a 1-letter suffix.

The fact that "Champion" is under all other text leads me to believe that this gun was made after 1925. The 1-letter suffix leads me to believe that the gun was made before 1929.
So, on an Iver Johnson 20 gauge champion made between 1925 and 1929, what length chamber would they have machined into it?

Link to pictures of the gun in question:

https://imgur.com/a/2rFTrdq

[postban]

might help some;
https://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/iv...serial-number/

[J Carter]

might help some;
https://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/iv...serial-number/

That is neat, thank you.

[Garymac]

Don't know about IJs, but I have an old single shot called a Nitro King, made just after the turn of the 20th century. It uses standard 2.75" shells.

[J Carter]

Don't know about IJs, but I have an old single shot called a Nitro King, made just after the turn of the 20th century. It uses standard 2.75" shells.

Thank you for your input!

[RifleGuy]

I have the same shotgun in 16 gauge out in the shop!

[MCPO_SOCM_RET]

On the receiver it says the following:

"Iver Johnson Arms & Cycle works
Fitchburg, Mass U.S.A.
Champion"

The serial number has a 1-letter suffix.

The fact that "Champion" is under all other text leads me to believe that this gun was made after 1925. The 1-letter suffix leads me to believe that the gun was made before 1929.
So, on an Iver Johnson 20 gauge champion made between 1925 and 1929, what length chamber would they have machined into it?

From Vorisek's book:
1909 – 1919: all Arabic numerals
1920 – 1929: Arabic numerals plus a single alphabetic letter suffixed
1930 – 1939: Arabic numerals plus two alphabetic letters suffixed
1940 – 1957: all alphabetic characters only using “Fitchburg” and ” X” corresponding to 1 through zero.

"Champion" as the last line of text really has nothing to do with a specific date of manufacture. As you could order complete frame replacements from H&D Folsom Arms catalogs with Champion as the last line of text as far back as 1917 (or was it book 17 published in 1919?) and most certainly before 1925. I believe that Champion went solo to the 'bottom' in block lettering when Cooey, HW Machine & Arms Co started making some Champion parts for Iver - which was 1919. If you can find a patent date of June 15 1919 somewhere on the gun, that would confirm it. Campion made it's way back to the top 'inline' offset right late 30's early 40's and finally centered 'script' text above one line containing the rest of what you have typed there early 40's onward.

Either way, in at least the 1920-1929 DOM range that's in question a factory replacement barrel could be had for $5.00 (3" chamber, 20ga, fixed full choke, 28" single barrel -- part #850 from Cooey, Folsom and Iver direct).
Now that doesn't mean you can grab a box of 3" el cheapo and boom away.
Remember, the chamber length is the actual measurement of an "uncrimped" shellcase. And is the length from breech face to the beginning of the "throat", that guides the wad and shot into the barrel.
With older shotguns, and especially how the shells were made (crimped, rolled, plastic or paper wad - or even "other" material wadding, etc) during the era of manufacture 3" could mean something completely different than modern 3" rounds. Hell it could even be that weirdo 2-9/16 rolled paper shell with thin cardstock holding the pellets in the shell.

First thing I'd be concerned with is the metal and what pressures are safe in its' current state for something a HUNDRED YEARS OLD.
I won't even try to guess or mumble "you should be ok" - actually give it to a pro to inspect first. Could be stress fractures, wall thinning, all sorts of bad juju.

Have it looked at by a competent gunsmith before you even try to figure out the correct modern size shell/load to use. The smith can also tell you that info in short order - chamber size that is.

My head hurts now.

[MCPO_SOCM_RET]

If it isn't safe to shoot - keep it the way it is. And make it a wall hanger.

If it's like any of my grandad's hand downs, there's probably electric tape holding something on somewhere with a wild tale regarding how it was fixed in a fight for his life against a rabid fox squirrel. Good memories staring at rusty guns hanging on nails!

[J Carter]

From Vorisek's book:
1909 – 1919: all Arabic numerals
1920 – 1929: Arabic numerals plus a single alphabetic letter suffixed
1930 – 1939: Arabic numerals plus two alphabetic letters suffixed
1940 – 1957: all alphabetic characters only using “Fitchburg” and ” X” corresponding to 1 through zero.

"Champion" as the last line of text really has nothing to do with a specific date of manufacture. As you could order complete frame replacements from H&D Folsom Arms catalogs with Champion as the last line of text as far back as 1917 (or was it book 17 published in 1919?) and most certainly before 1925. I believe that Champion went solo to the 'bottom' in block lettering when Cooey, HW Machine & Arms Co started making some Champion parts for Iver - which was 1919. If you can find a patent date of June 15 1919 somewhere on the gun, that would confirm it. Campion made it's way back to the top 'inline' offset right late 30's early 40's and finally centered 'script' text above one line containing the rest of what you have typed there early 40's onward.

Either way, in at least the 1920-1929 DOM range that's in question a factory replacement barrel could be had for $5.00 (3" chamber, 20ga, fixed full choke, 28" single barrel -- part #850 from Cooey, Folsom and Iver direct).
Now that doesn't mean you can grab a box of 3" el cheapo and boom away.
Remember, the chamber length is the actual measurement of an "uncrimped" shellcase. And is the length from breech face to the beginning of the "throat", that guides the wad and shot into the barrel.
With older shotguns, and especially how the shells were made (crimped, rolled, plastic or paper wad - or even "other" material wadding, etc) during the era of manufacture 3" could mean something completely different than modern 3" rounds. Hell it could even be that weirdo 2-9/16 rolled paper shell with thin cardstock holding the pellets in the shell.

First thing I'd be concerned with is the metal and what pressures are safe in its' current state for something a HUNDRED YEARS OLD.
I won't even try to guess or mumble "you should be ok" - actually give it to a pro to inspect first. Could be stress fractures, wall thinning, all sorts of bad juju.

Have it looked at by a competent gunsmith before you even try to figure out the correct modern size shell/load to use. The smith can also tell you that info in short order - chamber size that is.

My head hurts now.

Thank you! your post was very informative. While I believe this gun was in use as recently as 10 years ago, I will get it inspected before shooting it.

[gman]

I can’t add any info, but I do have one like it in .410 hanging on the wall add the cabin except that it’s missing the electrical tape. lol I would never dream of shooting it, because as decent as mine looks on the outside, the bore looks like it’s been in salt water all it’s life. Very cool wall hagers!